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Thread: How long until we have colonize Mars?

  1. #871
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoshuaDavid View Post
    Has anyone confirm that dragon can support a manned mission yet? If not then it will either be mct or an add on to the sls program. I agree that it would make sense to just rely on spacex but will manned dragon missions be long enough to go to mars?
    Dragon can not yet support a manned mission, but neither can Orion. An uncrewed mission of a complete Dragon V2 is supposed to be launched to the ISS late this year, and a crewed one early next year. Orion won't carry crew until 2023 at the earliest, and will need a heat shield redesign before it can be used on a Mars mission.


    Quote Originally Posted by Noclevername View Post
    The Red Dragon configuration for Mars missions will be a capsule plus a life supporting habitat module. I assume they'll send a lander ahead of time.
    Red Dragon is an uncrewed Dragon V2, with any required modifications to support the payloads. The 2018 mission is to test little more than the entry, descent, and landing on Mars, but they've discussed possible sample return with a small vehicle launched through the top hatch. It should be possible to land some humans with Dragons, but it sounds like their main operations will be with MCTs that can refuel and launch again, and return crew to Earth.

  2. #872
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    on the spacex sub reddit i remember seeing something from elon that said you wouldnt really want to put people in there and go to mars because on the inside it is about the size of an suv

  3. #873
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    Good news for colonizing Mars. The Dutch have grown crops on simulated Martian soil. The result was very encouraging and the food edible.

    http://www.marsdaily.com/reports/Dut...o_eat_999.html

    Dutch scientists said Thursday crops of four vegetables and cereals grown on soil similar to that on Mars have been found safe to eat, amid plans for the first manned mission to the planet.

    Abundant harvests of radishes, peas, rye and tomatoes all grown on the soil were found to contain "no dangerous levels" of heavy metals, said the team from Wageningen University in the Netherlands.

    "These remarkable results are very promising," said senior ecologist Wieger Wamelink.

    "We can actually eat the radishes, peas, rye and tomatoes, and I am very curious what they will taste like."

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    Good. Matt won't starve now.

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    Elon Musk puts more meat on his vision for Mars.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/alexkna.../#7f3b9eb53bc9

    "In a paper summarizing remarks from a recent talk, SpaceX founder and CEO Elon Musk makes his argument for the feasibility of a "self-sustaining city on Mars," further expanding on a vision he initially laid out in 2012 and has continued to refine since then."

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    I look for BFR/ITS to change a bit. I hope he goes for all steel Sea Dragon.

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    Lockheed Martin unveils fully reusable crewed M is just over a decade away, and Lockheed Martin revealed Thursday how humans might soon walk upon the red planet's surface.
    artian lander. It can also be used for the moon.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/28/lock...an-lander.html

    Lockheed Martin gave CNBC a first look at its new spacecraft prototype, which the company will unveil Thursday at this year's International Astronautical Congress in Adelaide, Australia.

    "This is a single-stage, completely reusable lander which will be able to both descend and ascend," said Lockheed Martin's Robert Chambers.

    Chambers is a senior systems engineer at the aerospace and defense giant, helping to lead the Mars Base Camp project. The concept is Lockheed Martin's vision for what may come after NASA's Deep Space Gateway mission, which will begin in the early 2020s.

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    Elon Musk hopes to have boots on the ground on Mars by 2024.

    https://spaceflightnow.com/2017/09/2...round-in-2024/

    SpaceX plans to begin construction of a new rocket and spacecraft next year that could lead to human landings on Mars as early as 2024, scaling up technologies currently being perfected with the company’s Falcon 9 family of boosters to ensure reliability, reusability and, as a result, realistically low costs, founder Elon Musk said Friday.

    Musk first unveiled his long-range plans for exploring and eventually colonizing Mars last year. On Friday, speaking at the International Astronautical Congress in Adelaide, Australia, he provided an updated architecture featuring a single, somewhat smaller spacecraft and more important, he said, a viable way to fund the program.

    “In last year’s presentation, we were really searching for how to pay for this thing. We went through various ideas, Kickstarter, you know, collecting underpants,” he joked. “These didn’t pan out. But now we think we’ve got a way to do it, which is to have a smaller vehicle — it’s still pretty big — but one that can do everything that’s needed.”

    The idea, he continued, is to make SpaceX’s current fleet of Falcon 9 rockets, the yet-to-fly Falcon Heavy and its Dragon cargo/crew ships “redundant.”

    “We want to have one system, one booster and ship that replaces Falcon 9, Falcon Heavy and Dragon,” he said. “If we can do that, then all the resources that are used for Falcon 9 Heavy and Dragon can be applied to this system. That’s really fundamental.”

    The new rocket is still known as the BFR, a euphemism for “Big (fill-in-the-blank) Rocket.”

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    Can we live on Mars permanently?

    http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest...isru-tech.html

    What do we mean when we say an environment is “habitable”? When referring to exoplanets, the term “habitability” is usually equated to whether or not liquid water can exist on the planet’s surface. But that doesn’t always answer the question of whether humans can inhabit a given environment. After all, Earth’s South Pole doesn’t have liquid water on the surface. Neither does low-Earth orbit. Yet resourceful humans have been inhabiting both locations for decades.

    What about Mars? Mars is on the outer boundary of our solar system’s habitable zone, and we know what looks like briny, liquid water can exist on the surface for short periods of time. But does that really make Mars habitable? From a practical standpoint, the answer depends on what technologies we bring there to create our own artificial habitable zones on the surface.

    Long-term habitation on Mars will require us to master the conversion of raw Martian materials into resources we can use to survive. Fortunately, Mars has a wealth of these materials, making it arguably the most human-habitable place in the solar system, other than the Earth itself.

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    When we start colonising Mars, we most probably need a transit base orbiting Mars. What better than covert one of the Mars moons as a base.

    Before that we need to learn more about the moon and their composition. We now have a tool to help us in this quest - Mars Odyssey. After 16 years observing Mars, it has trained its camera and instruments on Mars moons.

    https://www.space.com/38378-mars-ody...bos-photo.html

    After 16 years of orbiting the Red Planet, NASA's record-breaking Mars Odyssey spacecraft has captured its first photos of the Martian moon Phobos.

    Mars Odyssey launched in 2001 and is the oldest operational spacecraft at the Red Planet. Since it arrived at Mars, the spacecraft has only looked down at the Martian surface and hasn't been pointing its cameras up at Mars' moons. But on Sept. 29, Mars Odyssey snapped its first-ever images of the potato-shaped moon Phobos.

    The spacecraft's Thermal Emission Imaging System (THEMIS) camera has helped researchers study the composition of Mars by providing both visible-light and infrared images of the planet's surface. Now that Mars Odyssey has shown that it is capable of imaging moons as well, the mission can begin to do the same types of observations of both Martian moons, Phobos and Deimos.

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    It would take 100 thousand years to fully terraform Mars, according to estimates. But I suppose if you don't mind living under domes for your entire lives (and it appears we don't, given our proclivity for shopping malls) then we might have a Martian colony sooner than that.
    "Occam" is the name of the alien race that will enslave us all eventually. And they've got razors for hands. I don't know if that's true but it seems like the simplest answer."

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    To understand what it is like living on Mars we try to simulate the environment here on earth. The US has HI-SEAS Mars simulation, the Chinese are building one, the Russians have Mars 500 and now the Europeans also have one.

    http://www.marsdaily.com/reports/In_..._Mars_999.html

    Would-be astronauts in aluminium-coated suits venture out in rovers from a sprawling camp in Oman's barren desert: a simulation by a European venture aiming to one day help humans survive on Mars.

    Behind a barbed wire fence protected by soldiers from the Gulf sultanate, researchers in prefab facilities work away on experiments that include trying to grow vegetables in inhospitable terrain chosen for its resemblance to the red planet.

    Run by the Austrian Space Forum, a mainly volunteer collective, with the backing of the Omani government, the AMADEE-18 Mars Analog Mission has brought together researchers, inventors, space professionals and enthusiasts.

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    The 6th HI-SEAS expedition has started.

    http://www.hawaiitribune-herald.com/...lation-begins/

    [QUOTEThe University of Hawaii’s sixth Mars mission simulation will begin today as another crew starts eight months of isolation inside a dome on Mauna Loa.

    The NASA-funded Hawaii Space Exploration Analog and Simulation, or HI-SEAS, tests human behavior and performance during long periods of isolation, similar to what astronauts might experience on a mission to the Red Planet. They are only allowed to venture outside with protective suits and all communications are placed on a 20-minute delay.][/QUOTE]

  14. #884
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    While the HI-SEAS expedition has started in the US in Hawaii (see above).over in Africa another Mars expedition is also starting in Oman.

    http://www.planetary.org/blogs/jason...amadee-18.html

    This month, 25 countries are participating in a simulated Mars mission in southern Oman, near the borders of Yemen and Saudi Arabia. There, in the barren Dhofar Desert, temperatures can top 51 degrees Celsius (125 degrees Fahrenheit), making it a pretty inhospitable spot for humans—just like Mars. The mission, AMADEE-18 (PDF press kit), lasts four weeks, during which five astronauts will live in inflatable habitats and conduct experiments ranging from growing produce to operating robotic field rovers.

    I know about planetary analog missions in general, but mostly just the NASA ones, such as HERA, NEEMO, and Desert RATS. AMADEE is a project of the Austrian Space Forum, a group that links up various corners of Austria's space industry.

    I heard about AMADEE from Sam McNeil, an Associated Press reporter who covers the Middle East and North Africa. Sam and I graduated together from the University of Arizona. He visited the AMADEE-18 crew earlier this month, and although I can't re-post his AP work, I can link to it! First, here's the written story and a very nice photo gallery:

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    Quote Originally Posted by selvaarchi View Post
    To understand what it is like living on Mars we try to simulate the environment here on earth. The US has HI-SEAS Mars simulation, the Chinese are building one, the Russians have Mars 500 and now the Europeans also have one.

    http://www.marsdaily.com/reports/In_..._Mars_999.html
    The Israel has one too - D-Mars

    https://in.reuters.com/article/us-sp...-idINKCN1G20T5

    A team of six Israeli researchers on Sunday ended a four-day Mars habitat experiment in Israel’s Negev desert where they simulated living conditions on the Red Planet, Israel’s Science and Technology Ministry said.

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    HI-SEAS expedition has been suspended because of a medical condition of one of the crew. Imagine if this has happened on Mars or travelling to Mars

    http://www.staradvertiser.com/2018/0...rs-simulation/

    The University of Hawaii at Manoa’s months-long Mars simulation mission was suspended today — five days after it began — because of a medical incident.

    A crew member of the Hawaii Space Exploration Analog and Simulation was taken to Hilo Medical Center about 8 a.m. today because of an undisclosed medical condition and was under observation for a few hours before being released, UH spokesman Dan Meisenzahl said.

    In accordance with safety protocols, the crew left the HI-SEAS dome at the 8,200-foot level of Mauna Loa on Hawaii island and the mission has been suspended.

  17. #887
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    HI-SEAS is not the only simulation NASA has. The have one at NASA’s Johnson Space Center as well.

    https://www.click2houston.com/news/a...-place-at-nasa

    Imagine spending 45 days cut off from the rest of the world, missing big events such as the Super Bowl, the Olympics and the rodeo.

    Four people, who met shortly before the study began at NASA’s Johnson Space Center, are living in a 2 1/2-story habitat for a month and a half.

    It's a mission to an asteroid without leaving Earth.

  18. #888
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    Elon Musk gives an update on his vision for Mars and the Big Falcon Rocket (BFR)

    http://www.marsdaily.com/reports/Elo...Space_999.html

    In "Making Life Multi-Planetary" Elon Musk, CEO and Lead Designer at SpaceX, presents the updated design for the Big Falcon Rocket (BFR), the powerful rocket intended to propel a newly modified space vehicle to the International Space Station and beyond to fulfill his vision for establishing a human presence on Mars.

    The article, a summary of Mr. Musk's presentation at the 68th International Astronautical Congress, is published in New Space, a peer-reviewed journal from Mary Ann Liebert, Inc., publishers. The article is available free on the New Space website.

    Mr. Musk not only provides details on the BFR's updated design but, importantly, presents a plan for how to pay for it. He describes the development of a huge carbon fiber tank that is capable of holding the cryogenic liquid oxygen needed to fuel the rocket, and the key to the SpaceX business case, how on orbit refueling will take place.

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    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2018arXiv180204078K

    A concept of biopharmaceutical nanosatellite

    Kornakiewicz, Anna; Mielczarek, Jakub; Zadrozny, Adam
    02/2018

    The article is a short overview of a proposal of a CubeSat type nanosatellite designed to conduct biopharmaceutical tests on the low earth orbit. Motivations behind the emerging demand for such solution nowadays and in the close future are emphasized. The possible objectives and challenges to be addressed in the planned biopharmaceutical CubeSat missions are discussed. In particular, it is hard to imagine progress of the space tourism and colonization of Mars without a wide-ranging development of pharmaceutics dedicated to be used in space. Finally, an exemplary layout of a 3U type CubeSat is presented. We stress that, thanks to recent development in both nanosatellite technologies and lab-on-a-chip type biofluidic systems the proposed idea becomes now both feasible and relatively affordable.

    =======================================

    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2018PrAeS..98...74N

    Materials and design concepts for space-resilient structures

    Naser, Mohannad Z.; Chehab, Alaa I.
    04/2018

    Space exploration and terraforming nearby planets have been fascinating concepts for the longest time. Nowadays, that technological advancements with regard to space exploration are thriving, it is only a matter of time before humans can start colonizing nearby moons and planets. This paper presents a state-of-the-art literature review on recent developments of "space-native" construction materials, and highlights evolutionary design concepts for "space-resilient" structures (i.e., colonies and habitats). This paper also details effects of harsh (and unique) space environments on various terrestrial and extraterrestrial construction materials, as well as on space infrastructure and structural systems. The feasibility of exploiting available space resources in terms of "in-situ resource utilization" and "harvesting of elements and compounds", as well as emergence of enabling technologies such as "cultured (lab-grown)" space construction materials are discussed. Towards the end of the present review, number of limitations and challenges facing Lunar and Martian exploration, and venues in-need for urgent research are identified and examined.

    ======================================

    Want to colonize Mars? Well, how much do you like potatoes?


    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2018AAS...23140106G

    Mars Gardens in the University - Red Thumbs: Growing Vegetables in Martian regolith simulant.

    Guinan, Edward Francis
    01/2018

    Over the next few decades NASA and private enterprise missions plan to send manned missions to Mars with the ultimate aim to establish a permanent human presence on this planet. For a self-sustaining colony on Mars it will be necessary to provide food by growing plants in sheltered greenhouses on the Martian surface. As part of an undergraduate student project in Astrobiology at Villanova University, experiments are being carried out, testing how various plants grow in Martian regolith. A wide sample of plants are being grown and tested in Mars regolith simulant commercially available from The Martian Garden (TheMartian Garden.com). This Mars regolith simulant is based on Mojave Mars Simulant (MMS) developed by NASA and JPL for the Mars Phoenix mission. The MMS is based on the Mojave Saddleback basalt similar that used by JPL/NASA. Additional reagents were added to this iron rich basalt to bring the chemical content close to actual Mars regolith. The MMS used is an approximately 90% similar to regolith found on the surface of Mars - excluding poisonous perchlorates commonly found on actual Mars surface.The students have selected various vegetables and herbs to grow and test. These include carrots, spinach, dandelions, kale, soy beans, peas, onions, garlic and of course potatoes and sweet potatoes. Plants were tested in various growing conditions, using different fertilizers, and varying light conditions and compared with identical ``control plants'' grown in Earth soil / humus. The results of the project will be discussed from an education view point as well as from usefulness for fundamental research.We thank The Martian Garden for providing Martian regolith simulant at education discounted prices.

    ======================================

    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2018AcAau.146..117S

    Application of virtual reality for crew mental health in extended-duration space missions

    Salamon, Nick; Grimm, Jonathan M.; Horack, John M.; Newton, Elizabeth K.
    05/2018

    Human exploration of the solar system brings a host of environmental and engineering challenges. Among the most important factors in crew health and human performance is the preservation of mental health. The mental well-being of astronaut crews is a significant issue affecting the success of long-duration space missions, such as habitation on or around the Moon, Mars exploration, and eventual colonization of the solar system. If mental health is not properly addressed, these missions will be at risk. Upkeep of mental health will be especially difficult on long duration missions because many of the support systems available to crews on shorter missions will not be available. In this paper, we examine the use of immersive virtual reality (VR) simulations to maintain healthy mental states in astronaut crews who are removed from the essential comforts typically associated with terrestrial life. Various methods of simulations and their administration are analyzed in the context of current research and knowledge in the fields of psychology, medicine, and space sciences, with a specific focus on the environment faced by astronauts on long-term missions. The results of this investigation show that virtual reality should be considered a plausible measure in preventing mental state deterioration in astronauts, though more work is needed to provide a comprehensive view of the effectiveness and administration of VR methods.

    =====================================

    http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2018AIPC.1959d0020S

    Sunlight reflection off the spacecraft with a solar sail on the surface of mars

    Starinova, O. L.; Rozhkov, M. A.; Gorbunova, I. V.
    05/2018

    Modern technologies make it possible to fulfill many projects in the field of space exploration. One such project is the colonization of Mars and providing favorable conditions for living on it. Authors propose principles of functioning of the spacecraft with a solar sail, intended to create a thermal and light spot in a predetermined area of the Martian surface. This additional illumination can maintain and support certain climatic conditions on a small area where a Mars base could be located. This paper investigate the possibility of the spacecraft continuously reflect the sunlight off the solar sail on the small area of the Mars surface. The mathematical motion model in such condition of the solar sail's orientation is considered and used for motion simulation session. Moreover, the analysis of this motion is performed. Thus, were obtained parameters of the synchronic non-Keplerian orbit and spacecraft construction. In addition, were given recommendations for further applying satellites to reflect the sunlight on a planet's surface.
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    https://bgr.com/2018/09/03/co2-conve...nge-mars-nasa/
    NASA will pay you up to $750,000 to come up with a way to turn CO2 into other molecules on Mars

    When NASA launches manned missions to space they have to bring just about everything along with them. You can’t reach out into space for resources when you’re cruising in orbit aboard the International Space Station, and the Apollo missions to the Moon didn’t attempt to turn anything on the lunar surface into anything useful for the trip. When NASA sends humans to Mars, that’s going to have to change. Missions to Mars will need to be as lean as possible, meaning that using any available resources on the Red Planet will be of utmost importance. With that in mind, NASA just announced the CO2 Conversion Challenge, which asks teams of scientists and inventors to come up with a way to turn CO2 into molecules that can be used to produce all manner of things. And there’s big prize money on the line. To start, NASA is asking teams to focus on converting CO2 to Glucose, but the language of the challenge suggests you can approach that goal from any angle you wish: "Help us discover ways to develop novel synthesis technologies that use carbon dioxide (CO2) as the sole carbon source to generate molecules that can be used to manufacture a variety of products, including “substrates” for use in microbial bioreactors."
    Because CO2 is readily abundant within the Martian atmosphere, such technologies will translate into in-situ manufacturing of products to enable humans to live and thrive on the planet, and also be implemented on Earth by using both waste and atmospheric CO2 as a resource. Teams or individuals who want to participate will need to register by January 24, 2019, and then officially apply by February 28. Experts will review each plan and award up to $250,000 spread across up to five individuals or teams. The next phase of the competition is still a bit light on details. NASA says it’ll announce the rules and criteria once Phase 1 is complete, but the administration has revealed that it’s ready to award up to $750,000 to the individual, team, or teams that can demonstrate that their system(s) work as intended and could be used by astronauts on Mars.
    There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
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    https://www.space.com/39760-mars-ice...-pictures.html

    Mars Ice Home: A Red Planet Colony Concept in Pictures

    By Chelsea Gohd, Space.com Staff Writer | September 1, 2018 07:45am ET

    =================

    https://www.space.com/41697-hp-mars-...challenge.html

    These Stunning Designs Show What Our Future on Mars Might Look Like

    By Chelsea Gohd, Space.com Staff Writer | September 1, 2018 08:00am ET
    There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
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    Suggestion that perhaps Mars colonization, and even crewed landings, should wait a long while.


    https://phys.org/news/2018-11-coloni...aign=item-menu

    Colonizing Mars means contaminating Mars – and never knowing for sure if it had its own native life

    November 6, 2018 by David Weintraub, The Conversation

    The closest place in the universe where extraterrestrial life might exist is Mars, and human beings are poised to attempt to colonize this planetary neighbor within the next decade. Before that happens, we need to recognize that a very real possibility exists that the first human steps on the Martian surface will lead to a collision between terrestrial life and biota native to Mars. If the red planet is sterile, a human presence there would create no moral or ethical dilemmas on this front. But if life does exist on Mars, human explorers could easily lead to the extinction of Martian life. As an astronomer who explores these questions in my book "Life on Mars: What to Know Before We Go," I contend that we Earthlings need to understand this scenario and debate the possible outcomes of colonizing our neighboring planet in advance. Maybe missions that would carry humans to Mars need a timeout.
    There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger E. Moore View Post
    Suggestion that perhaps Mars colonization, and even crewed landings, should wait a long while.


    https://phys.org/news/2018-11-coloni...aign=item-menu

    Colonizing Mars means contaminating Mars and never knowing for sure if it had its own native life

    November 6, 2018 by David Weintraub, The Conversation

    The closest place in the universe where extraterrestrial life might exist is Mars, and human beings are poised to attempt to colonize this planetary neighbor within the next decade. Before that happens, we need to recognize that a very real possibility exists that the first human steps on the Martian surface will lead to a collision between terrestrial life and biota native to Mars. If the red planet is sterile, a human presence there would create no moral or ethical dilemmas on this front. But if life does exist on Mars, human explorers could easily lead to the extinction of Martian life. As an astronomer who explores these questions in my book "Life on Mars: What to Know Before We Go," I contend that we Earthlings need to understand this scenario and debate the possible outcomes of colonizing our neighboring planet in advance. Maybe missions that would carry humans to Mars need a timeout.
    That just means never doing anything with Mars. No spacecraft can be fully sterilized. Every probe we land on Mars contaminates it to some extent...most severely in the area of the probe, obviously. In the most optimistic case, we continue sending probe after probe, each barely scratching the surface in a limited area and achieving diminishing returns at increasing expense and with an ever-increasing probability of having contaminated what we're trying to study. If one finds signs of life, we'll never know with any certainty it wasn't contamination, while if none find any, it only means it hasn't been found...you can't prove Mars is sterile with a probe here and there. A far more likely outcome is that we lose interest and stop sending probes.

    A human presence means heavier equipment capable of digging deeper while doing better at isolating samples from contamination, the ability to quickly take statistically meaningful numbers of samples across widely separated sites, and local laboratories that don't require transporting samples to Earth's microbe-filled environment. Equipment could even be assembled and sterilized on the surface to far tighter standards than would be practical for equipment launched from Earth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjameshuff View Post
    . If one finds signs of life, we'll never know with any certainty it wasn't contamination, while if none find any, it only means it hasn't been found...
    Incorrect. We can determine from DNA analysis how long ago a species diverged from the most recent common ancestor. Terrestrial germs will show a close relationship to other terrestrial germs. Their genes will clearly be of recent Earth vintage.
    "I'm planning to live forever. So far, that's working perfectly." Steven Wright

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    It's an interesting issue. If life were found, it might be found to be somewhat related but significantly divergent or so different there's no realistic concern about contamination (like something that doesn't use DNA or RNA). But there are so many different variations on Earth, if there were something close to known life, there could always be a question of whether contamination happened.

    I just consider the issue somewhat moot - I expect people will land on Mars within four or five decades, at least for limited missions, with some level of colonization a bit after that. Big reusable rockets are being developed, and if the U.S. isn't sufficiently interested in funding Mars missions, I expect China, India, or some international effort will be. We've started to see how some of the costs can be brought down somewhat, and other needed technology is advancing. We aren't going to hold off forever because contamination could affect hypothetical Mars life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger E. Moore View Post
    Suggestion that perhaps Mars colonization, and even crewed landings, should wait a long while.


    https://phys.org/news/2018-11-coloni...aign=item-menu

    Colonizing Mars means contaminating Mars – and never knowing for sure if it had its own native life

    ...
    The closest place in the universe where extraterrestrial life might exist is Mars,
    ...
    I get that this statement is plausible but we really don't know.

    Also, I get the concern. If we did find some kind of alien critters, every step must be taken to slow things down.

    The problem is we proceed blindly and lack of evidence of life will not be enough to assuage concerns. Maybe, for reasons not yet determined, the asteroids could be a source of exbiology. Or the moon. And somebody may come up with a model supporting these ideas. And we will be called upon to keep these places pristine lest we interfere with Mother Nature.

    I don't know. sigh

  27. #897
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    Quote Originally Posted by 7cscb View Post
    Maybe, for reasons not yet determined, the asteroids could be a source of exbiology. Or the moon. And somebody may come up with a model supporting these ideas. And we will be called upon to keep these places pristine lest we interfere with Mother Nature.
    Thing is, there's a number of different types of asteroids with very different compositions. So excluding one kind isn't going to exclude them all.


    But I wouldn't worry, based on our environmental record here on Earth we'll give lip service to protecting ET bugs, then ignore all those concerns and bull ahead anyway.
    "I'm planning to live forever. So far, that's working perfectly." Steven Wright

  28. #898
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    Seems unbearably tedious, but hey, you're driving a robot car on Mars. Balances out. No quotes, too difficult to make sense.


    https://phys.org/news/2018-11-robot-mars.html#nRlv

    How to drive a robot on Mars

    November 12, 2018 by Ivan Couronne
    There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
    Mark Twain, Life on the Mississippi (1883)

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