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Thread: Does sun have a number?

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jens View Post
    What do the sun and number one have in common?
    They are both yellow!
    The Sun is white, it's far too often presented or named as yellow, which is patently false, at least in the context of its "true" color, not sunset colors. So how do we advance the corrective process? Hyperbole and humor help, perhaps. These two colors applied to the Sun can be made analogous to snow color, btw.
    We know time flies, we just can't see its wings.

  2. #32
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    It should have a number for the very simple reason that if someone has or makes a charting program for stars, it would be simpler to give the sun a number instead of writing a special line of code to handle and/or convert a string for one specific object.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  3. #33
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    Okay, Ara Pacis, Let's give the Sun a "number" in the most
    widely-used star designation system -- the Bayer system.
    Which constellation is the Sun in?

    -- Jeff, in Minneapolis
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Root View Post
    Okay, Ara Pacis, Let's give the Sun a "number" in the most
    widely-used star designation system -- the Bayer system.
    Which constellation is the Sun in?
    That's a cool idea. We can give it different names over the course of the year!
    As above, so below

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    It should have a number for the very simple reason that if someone has or makes a charting program for stars, it would be simpler to give the sun a number instead of writing a special line of code to handle and/or convert a string for one specific object.
    Exactly right. Any kind of program with a set or list, not just the charting example. Extra couple of lines, or add a layer of complexity by having a translation table translating the chosen identifiers (or key indexes) to preferred display names. Catalogs are nice because you don't have to choose and work out an indexing system of identifiers each time you want to use a certain list. And working with the same lists makes it easier to compare stuff against other programs or uses. So, not required, but assigning a number sure makes some things easier. It's certainly not such a ridiculous idea as some make it out to be.
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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by slang View Post
    Exactly right. Any kind of program with a set or list, not just the charting example. Extra couple of lines, or add a layer of complexity by having a translation table translating the chosen identifiers (or key indexes) to preferred display names. Catalogs are nice because you don't have to choose and work out an indexing system of identifiers each time you want to use a certain list. And working with the same lists makes it easier to compare stuff against other programs or uses. So, not required, but assigning a number sure makes some things easier. It's certainly not such a ridiculous idea as some make it out to be.
    Many of the catalogue numbers I have seen are alphanumeric strings, so this seems a non-issue. When I used to do PLM programming, all the part numbers — there were only a few million — were strings

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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Root View Post
    Okay, Ara Pacis, Let's give the Sun a "number" in the most
    widely-used star designation system -- the Bayer system.
    Which constellation is the Sun in?

    -- Jeff, in Minneapolis
    From what position are you looking? I've seen planetarium programs that allow the viewer to fly away several light years and look at the constellations made by the sun and other stars. If we want to designate the Sun as the origin, we can still give it a number using the same identification schema, hence 0-0-1.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampyankee View Post
    Many of the catalogue numbers I have seen are alphanumeric strings, so this seems a non-issue. When I used to do PLM programming, all the part numbers — there were only a few million — were strings
    True, but I mean a string that has the same format as all the rest. This might make it easier to use between human readable print, computer calculations, and spreadsheets. This might not be important all the time, unless the format scheme includes data in the alphanumeric string such that an operation might use concatenation or comparison of various parts of the string.

    This might be important for a galactic coordinate system. Maybe we don't need that yet, but I like planning for the future. Think of it as a recognition of the Copernican Principle.

    But you're right, computers can handle strings - so we could just get rid of Bayer, Flamsteed, Hipparcos designations and use their ancient names. I'll go pop some corn while the IAU debates using Arabic vs. Chinese names - and alphabets.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  9. #39
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    how about 1 and have done with it!

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    True, but I mean a string that has the same format as all the rest. This might make it easier to use between human readable print, computer calculations, and spreadsheets. This might not be important all the time, unless the format scheme includes data in the alphanumeric string such that an operation might use concatenation or comparison of various parts of the string.

    This might be important for a galactic coordinate system. Maybe we don't need that yet, but I like planning for the future. Think of it as a recognition of the Copernican Principle.

    But you're right, computers can handle strings - so we could just get rid of Bayer, Flamsteed, Hipparcos designations and use their ancient names. I'll go pop some corn while the IAU debates using Arabic vs. Chinese names - and alphabets.
    Are the Flamsteed, Hipparcos, Bayer, and all the other catalogues using compatible designation systems, with the same formatting and the same number in all three catalogues referring to the same object? If not, you've got to add code for that, and adding the ancient names is trivial. Of course, if one was building a database of all the stars, one would have to deal with these incompatibilities, and would simply have the database apply a unique identifier; the individual catalogue numbers would be one of the database entries, but the people involved in building such a database would need to identify any overlaps between catalogues.
    Last edited by swampyankee; Yesterday at 02:33 AM.

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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampyankee View Post
    Are the Flamsteed, Hipparcos, Bayer, and all the other catalogues using compatible designation systems, with the same formatting and the same number in all three catalogues referring to the same object? If not, you've got to add code for that, and adding the ancient names is trivial. Of course, if one was building a database of all the stars, one would have to deal with these incompatibilities, and would simply have the database apply a unique identifier; the individual catalogue numbers would be one of the database entries, but the people involved in building such a database would need to identify any overlaps between catalogues.
    Exactly. Even stars that already have identifiers in those older systems will have a unique identifier in the new system, including the sun. Hence, the sun will have a number (or alphanumeric identifier, which is ultimately a number once converted to binary for machine use). The question I'm proposing is: what would it be.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    Exactly. Even stars that already have identifiers in those older systems will have a unique identifier in the new system, including the sun. Hence, the sun will have a number (or alphanumeric identifier, which is ultimately a number once converted to binary for machine use). The question I'm proposing is: what would it be.
    “Sol.” The database — probably a relational database — could have unique ids are not explicitly accessible. I think a 512 bit string may be sufficient :-)

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  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampyankee View Post
    “Sol.”
    Why not Taiyang?
    As above, so below

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jens View Post
    Why not Taiyang?
    No problem. One can set up the database so that numerous names, from "Sun" to "ಸೂರ್ಯನ" could all point to the same catalogue entry.

    Information about American English usage here and here. Floating point issues? Please read this before posting.

    How do things fly? This explains it all.

    Actually they can't: "Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible." - Lord Kelvin, president, Royal Society, 1895.



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