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Thread: Some Feedback On Dr. Grant's Wine Advice.

  1. #1
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    Some Feedback On Dr. Grant's Wine Advice.

    Oh, some feed back to Dr. Grant on his wine tasting advice with regard to white wine, that is.

    Got an answer, then have more questions. Of course. That's what answers do.

    Found a local innkeeper knowledgeable on the subject. Yuck. Malo fermentation is what I don't like about white wine. The further away from that characteristic, the better.

    Happy accident. Crowded night at a local Danish restaurant and the noise level was such, plus a conflict of accents, (the Danish restaurant is run by ex-pat Spaniards,) that we did a brief Abbot and Costello routine over Cabernet/Chardonnay and ended up with chardonnay.

    Of a sort I never had before. Absolutely no legs, sweet like a cider almost, and the most distinguishing feature was how intoxicating it was. As in, my brother and I could only have two classes, and we were within walking distance of home!

    THAT'S a little unusual.

    But we could never find it since! Even asking at the restaurant didn't help.

    Any idea what ballpark to even start looking in as to what kind of chardonnay they slipped us?
    Time wasted having fun is not time wasted - Lennon
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  2. #2
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    Can't help with your problem Don. I'm the sort of wine drinker who lets a little birdy advise me on what to buy. Cheep! Cheep! Cheep!
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  3. #3
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    Did I once recommend a MLF wine? Can't remember doing that, though it sounds like something I might have done. Sorry you didn't like it.

    (And gad, Don, it sounds like you were drinking some sort of pudding wine.)

    Grant Hutchison

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    Not so much a recommendation as a discussion, Dr. Grant.

    On the oddly potent, but tasty, chardonnay. Yeah, I had to look twice when I did the swirl. It fell all the way back down like water.

    You would think there would be an off taste like you get with fortified wine but that wasn't the case. And I misspoke. I meant sweet in that it wasn't cloying.
    Time wasted having fun is not time wasted - Lennon
    (John, not the other one.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDon View Post
    Not so much a recommendation as a discussion, Dr. Grant.

    On the oddly potent, but tasty, chardonnay. Yeah, I had to look twice when I did the swirl. It fell all the way back down like water.

    You would think there would be an off taste like you get with fortified wine but that wasn't the case. And I misspoke. I meant sweet in that it wasn't cloying.
    I am a big wine lover and have belonged to many wine tasting groups in the past/current. I have found that wine tasting is very much to the individuals tastes. For example I don't prefer white wines, the sweet ones not good for the diabetes, the dry taste is not preferred, although I will drink it if offered. Now red wines, not sweet ones, are very much in favor. We(wife and I) prefer a petite shiraz, or blend with that and Malbec's and or cabernets. This again is what we prefer, and many don't like the bold flavor. That is perfectly OK, each person has there own "perfect" taste.

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    Same here Mr. Knight. I usually drink reds.

    Didn't really become discriminating until I met my ex-wife's cousin. He's the main insurance agent for a lot of wineries here in California. He was the first to "break it down" for me as to what I was tasting and what I should be looking for.

    Oh, discovered by accident of circumstance that a chilled cabernet sauvignon goes really well with a spicy pasta. (Camping in the snow up in the Sierras. We had a tent big enough to build a large cookfire in. Ah, good times.)
    Time wasted having fun is not time wasted - Lennon
    (John, not the other one.)

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDon View Post
    Of a sort I never had before. Absolutely no legs, sweet like a cider almost...
    I thought legs were a result of sugar content, right? [Legs determine whether French wine is from southern or northern France.] The south region gets more sunshine, hence more sugar content. I learned this with reds, but I assume it is true of any wine.
    We know time flies, we just can't see its wings.

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    George, I not only looked twice at that no legs thing, I pointed it out to my brother.

    Oh great, a "One That Got Away" story, wine division. ()

    Well, a new bistro opened back in January and it's trying very hard to compete with a Michelin star rated restaurant right next door. The day time partner and I have gotten to a first name basis. (He takes it as a complement that when people do me favors I reward them with lunch at his place.) They have a massive wine list/cellar. I'll talk to him about it.
    Time wasted having fun is not time wasted - Lennon
    (John, not the other one.)

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by George View Post
    I thought legs were a result of sugar content, right? [Legs determine whether French wine is from southern or northern France.] The south region gets more sunshine, hence more sugar content. I learned this with reds, but I assume it is true of any wine.
    Yeah, legs are related to both sugar and alcohol content. Pretty pointless bit of wine-buff theatre, given that the taste tells you about sugar and the bottle label tells you about alcohol.
    If you give a pudding wine a whirl, it actually has so many "legs" it sometimes just wets the inside of the glass and then runs back down again, seamlessly. That potentially resolves the apparent paradox of Don's sweet(-ish) high alcohol wine with no legs.

    Grant Hutchison

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    Quote Originally Posted by George View Post
    I thought legs were a result of sugar content, right? [Legs determine whether French wine is from southern or northern France.] The south region gets more sunshine, hence more sugar content. I learned this with reds, but I assume it is true of any wine.
    Wait a second. I didn't know that. I wonder if this was a New York wine they sell as part of their list.
    Time wasted having fun is not time wasted - Lennon
    (John, not the other one.)

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Yeah, legs are related to both sugar and alcohol content. Pretty pointless bit of wine-buff theatre, given that the taste tells you about sugar and the bottle label tells you about alcohol. If you give a pudding wine a whirl, it actually has so many "legs" it sometimes just wets the inside of the glass and then runs back down again, seamlessly. That potentially resolves the apparent paradox of Don's sweet(-ish) high alcohol wine with no legs.
    Ah, so higher alcohol content lowers viscosity, which is logical. That explains why some sweeter wines I've swirled, like Don's wine, were legless. [I wasn't sure French wine had something else going for it.]

    It's my wife that gets the sweet wines,though usually only a moscato or something very similar. [There was a terrific German wine my wife really enjoyed that made here unusually happy and vivacious, right up to the moment she passed-out on the floor at our table of 20. We missed the next-day's Rhine boat tour but I did get to met some German medics in their ER that night and morning.]

    It was interesting to be in a wine contest where we had to guess the age and location of the French wine. It was part of a monastic wine tour near Paris. They explained how to test the wine (color for age and legs (or not) were part of the location equation), and then they tested us. Though not much of a wine drinker, I came in 3rd. My wife, who drinks almost no wine, came in 2nd but I helped her with one of the answers.
    Last edited by George; 2018-Jun-14 at 09:41 PM.
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  12. #12
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    I enjoy pretty much the full gamut of wine: dry reds and whites, the middlings, and on up to Sauternes, Trockenbeerenauslese, and Eiswein, especially if theyíre botrytized. Champagne, and other dry sparklers are probably my least favorite...which isnít to say I donít enjoy the occasional Sekt or Prosecco. Having lived roughly halfway between the Rhein and Mosel(-Saar-Ruver) regions, I developed an appreciation, affection, and weakness for German whites. Sadly, my favorite varietal, Kerner, is rarely available in my locale or region.
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  13. #13
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    I often wonder what the vintner buys, one half the value of the goods he sells.
    Omar Khyam fitzgerald translation
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by George View Post
    Ah, so higher alcohol content lowers viscosity, which is logical.
    It makes quite a complicated contribution to the formation of "legs", however, via the Gibbs-Marangoni effect.
    If you wet the side of the glass with wine, the alcohol evaporates faster than the water, so the surface tension rises in the wetted area, to become higher than the surface tension of the bulk liquid in the glass. So wine rises into the "legs" by capillary action. In general, the higher the alcohol content, the more pronounced the effect. (And if you stopper a half-full bottle of wine, leave it for a while for vapour pressures to equilibrate, and then give it a swirl, you'll see that the legs inside the bottle are slight or non-existent, confirming the role of evaporation in the process.)

    Sugar, causing increased viscosity, limits the rate of flow and so can modify the legs either by making them more persistent once formed, or by preventing them differentiating into individual legs.

    It's all quite complicated, and also depends on the nature of the glass surface. Hence my cynicism about this particular oenophile affectation - it's part of the ritual, but has very poor predictive value.

    Grant Hutchison
    Last edited by grant hutchison; 2018-Jun-15 at 03:54 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Sugar, causing increased viscosity, limits the rate of flow and so can modify the legs either by making them more persistent once formed, or by preventing them differentiating into individual legs.

    It's all quite complicated, and also depends on the nature of the glass surface. Hence my cynicism about this particular oenophile affectation - it's part of the ritual, but has very poor predictive value.
    Devilish detail stuff. Perhaps the French wine test -- it may have been just for something like a cab. with about the same alcohol content -- is one of the limited tests where they have a leg to stand on. [sorry, it's like scratching an itch, but I don't want ointment.]
    We know time flies, we just can't see its wings.

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