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samkent
2010-Mar-04, 07:35 PM
In the dead of winter, did the steam from locomotives turn into snow or ice?

Or did it evaporate into the dry air?

captain swoop
2010-Mar-04, 07:44 PM
I have spent many an hour in the winter working and riding on the NYMR. I haven't seen exhaust turn diectly to ice but it does condense and freezeon the loco body and valve gear.
It would have to be far colder than we get inthe UK for it to freeze in the air.

Swift
2010-Mar-04, 09:13 PM
I don't have Captain Swoop's experience, but I have seen steam locomotives operate in the winter and never seen that. The steam comes out at a pretty good temperature (I don't have a number) and a pretty high velocity. I suspect, that by the time it cools enough to freeze, that it is dispersed to a pretty low concentration and pretty small particles and they either just evaporate or sublimate (if they have already frozen).

Now, I've ridden open air cars behind steam locomotives in the summer time that were putting out enough ash that it looked like it was snowing. ;)

jokergirl
2010-Mar-05, 09:05 AM
Now, I've ridden open air cars behind steam locomotives in the summer time that were putting out enough ash that it looked like it was snowing. ;)

That's what I was thinking of too :) *winces in memory of ash in eye*

I wonder which temperature you need. We've had temperatures below -20Celsius pretty regularly this winter.

;)

chrlzs
2010-Mar-05, 09:51 AM
Basically, what you are after is contrail-conducive conditions at ground level... Very rare, but not unheard of:

http://contrailscience.com/ground-level-contrails/

No steam train pic's, sorry.

Swift
2010-Mar-05, 04:05 PM
I think steam locomotives are beautiful in any season, but they are particular beautiful in winter.
One example (http://www.pixdaus.com/pics/1263279625ubbhTG8.jpg)
second (http://www.massbayrre.org/SteaminSnow-DSpix.jpg)
third (http://4rail.net/4rail_pics_2007/sumptervalley_xmassexpress_900.jpg)

ABR.
2010-Mar-05, 04:22 PM
Here is a different link (http://www.landergallery.co.uk/Today/ArtworkImages/Exhibitions/marwood%20Thomas19%20snowplough%20fun%20wb.jpg) to Swift's link that got blocked!

JohnD
2010-Mar-05, 04:44 PM
Don't know about steam engines, but this is a favourite party trick on the Ice cap:
http://www.aad.gov.au/default.asp?casid=36572

Throw a cup of boiling water in the air - it never comes down!
Droplets vapourise in the very dry air, then condense into steam.
http://www.aad.gov.au/default.asp?casid=36572
I've heard that, well thrown,a saucepan of boiling water (greater mass) will do the same, but then will freeze and fall - as a micro-snowstorm!

John

captain swoop
2010-Mar-05, 09:05 PM
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p55141603.html
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p55278145.html
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p55278153.html
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p55278111.html

spot the railway
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p63448598.html
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p63448602.html
http://markt79.fotopic.net/p63448601.html

Some pictures from a gallery of last years Winter operations (2008/0 season
taken at Grosmont on the NYMR (Another of the vaulenteer workers)

chrlzs
2010-Mar-07, 08:17 AM
Don't know about steam engines, but this is a favourite party trick on the Ice cap:
http://www.aad.gov.au/default.asp?casid=36572

Throw a cup of boiling water in the air - it never comes down!
Droplets vapourise in the very dry air, then condense into steam.
http://www.aad.gov.au/default.asp?casid=36572
I've heard that, well thrown,a saucepan of boiling water (greater mass) will do the same, but then will freeze and fall - as a micro-snowstorm!

John

WOW!!! Hand-made Contrails!! That's way cool...

jokergirl
2010-Mar-08, 09:10 AM
Just do a search on youtube for "boiling water freezing in air" or similar - there are a bunch of videos of it!

http://www.chemistryland.com/CHM107/GlobalWarming/Antarctica_weather_ice_throw-w.jpg

;)

JohnD
2010-Mar-08, 02:56 PM
There must be an echo in here.
Is it all the ice in the air?

John

MAPNUT
2010-Mar-08, 04:16 PM
I don't know about steam engines, but the steam from all the geysers in Yellowstone Park http://www.nps.gov/archive/yell/oldfaithfulcam.htm just gets absorbed by the air. It's cold there, but I think it's pretty dry - hasn't snowed there in weeks.

mugaliens
2010-Mar-10, 10:51 AM
Just do a search on youtube for "boiling water freezing in air" or similar - there are a bunch of videos of it!

http://www.chemistryland.com/CHM107/GlobalWarming/Antarctica_weather_ice_throw-w.jpg

;)

Oooh!!! Ahhh...