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View Full Version : So people still believe Nasa is constantly lying to the public?



Tenshu
2010-Jun-10, 07:23 PM
I agreed to not post anymore youtube videos, and I will uphold that promise however last night I ran into a big of trouble on there.

I had left a comment a while back on one of David Morrison's video's before agreeing not to get involved with others anymore, but someone commented on my comment, so i went to the video breifly to read it, and what do I find, Someone by the name of indocronx going off like a madman with the following statements.

"People this guy is a snake of a [language] liar 1: 29 into this he says the sun is roughly in the direction of the galactic center and happens every year in December.... LMAO.. Truth is the sun will not be roughly near the center at all in 2012.. but it will indeed cross the galactic plane on the outskirts away from the center core of the galaxy which happens only once every 2600 years.. research people research.. and u will know this guy is full of [language]!!!"

" 3:15 into this he says. "there is no solar prediction for 2012" (2013 spring is next one)... but if you research that on any Nasa page it will tell you next maximum solar flare is expected in 2012. Funny thing is This obvious fake of a [language] Nasa scientist also tells you we have a solar maximum that takes place every 11yrs. Research our last 11yr cycle people, because the last solar maximum was in 2001. Now do the math cause this idiot cant even count & is claiming to work for NASA. (LMAO)"

I wanted to at least correct him about the Solar Storm's but he responded and went off on another tyrate..

"Last I checked, only 3 sites said NOAA sponsored by NASA has released a new prediction for 2013. Clearly all the others agree its 2012. So best way to get the truth is by doing the math. & if you knew any thing about the11 year solar maximum cycle then u would know that the last 1 was in 2001. 11 years from that is 2012. So I would advise you to look again before advising me to stop putting out the correct information. Fact is some 1 is lying so people can sleep better at night. "

"More proof that some Nasa links are putting out lies for example.. Google
"NASA - 2012: Beginning of the End or Why the World Won't End?" The 1st answer on this page is."Answer (A): Nothing bad will happen to the Earth in 2012. Our planet has been getting along just fine for more than 4 billion years,
(LMAO) yeah the Dinasoars all starved right & we never had a ice age, or world wide flood even though theres over 200 documents that state this.. Can't believe u retards fall for this [language] "

It's kinda sad to see what people have degenerated too these days, not that his comments have deterred others from posting but still this one person needs to be taught something at least to calm down.--;

NEOWatcher
2010-Jun-10, 07:29 PM
...It's kinda sad to see what people have degenerated too these days, not that his comments have deterred others from posting but still this one person needs to be taught something at least to calm down.--;Yep; anonymous people on the internet are frustrating.

Now; what shall we discuss here?

kleindoofy
2010-Jun-10, 07:39 PM
... anonymous people on the internet are frustrating. ...
Just like a majority of people not on the internet. ;)

Tenshu
2010-Jun-10, 07:39 PM
if i could prove him wrong about the solar storm's that alone would be enough, but then again it's probably not worth the effort since he'd say "It's by NASA they lie and you suck!" in response.

HenrikOlsen
2010-Jun-10, 07:56 PM
It's kinda sad to see what people have degenerated too these days, not that his comments have deterred others from posting but still this one person needs to be taught something at least to calm down.--;
You've once again confirmed what I already knew, YouTube commenters include some of the dumbest individuals on this planet.

Gillianren
2010-Jun-10, 07:56 PM
if i could prove him wrong about the solar storm's that alone would be enough, but then again it's probably not worth the effort since he'd say "It's by NASA they lie and you suck!" in response.

Well, yes.

Tenshu
2010-Jun-10, 08:00 PM
and now the order of kilopi shall kill me, like i expected--;;;

PetersCreek
2010-Jun-10, 08:10 PM
Tenshu,

I have edited your post to remove masked bad language that violates our rules...specifically, rule 3. I know they're supposed to be direct quotes but please take more care with the material you post here.

Additionally, I'm not seeing much discussion of a clear conspiracy theory. This isn't really the place to vent about anonymous YouTube screeds.

LaurelHS
2010-Jun-10, 08:38 PM
NASA is hardly the only agency studying solar weather. JAXA (http://www.jaxa.jp/article/special/solar-b/3/index_e.html) is one example of another space agency that does so. If NASA was constantly lying about solar flares, I'm pretty sure other space agencies would know about it.

This conspiracy theory is similar to the claim that NASA blacked out an area of Google Sky to hide Planet Nibiru. People don't consider that anyone with a telescope could just look at that area of the sky for themselves.

Swift
2010-Jun-10, 08:43 PM
NASA is hardly the only agency studying solar weather. JAXA (http://www.jaxa.jp/article/special/solar-b/3/index_e.html) is one example of another space agency that does so. If NASA was constantly lying about solar flares, I'm pretty sure other space agencies would know about it.
And, if I remember correctly, NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration) is the US agency that actually studies and predicts solar weather; NASA's role is to launch the spacecraft and assist with their operations.

HenrikOlsen
2010-Jun-10, 09:09 PM
if i could prove him wrong about the solar storm's that alone would be enough, but then again it's probably not worth the effort since he'd say "It's by NASA they lie and you suck!" in response.
http://xkcd.com/481/

Tenshu
2010-Jun-10, 09:37 PM
^ your right i am a moron and a fool, now i await death by the order of kilopi for making another big mistake--;

novaderrik
2010-Jun-10, 09:51 PM
Tenshu,

I have edited your post to remove masked bad language that violates our rules...specifically, rule 3. I know they're supposed to be direct quotes but please take more care with the material you post here.

Additionally, I'm not seeing much discussion of a clear conspiracy theory. This isn't really the place to vent about anonymous YouTube screeds.

where is the proper place to post it on this site? seems like this is the kind of thing that would get bounced from area to area until it just kind of fades away.

Swift
2010-Jun-10, 10:07 PM
where is the proper place to post it on this site? seems like this is the kind of thing that would get bounced from area to area until it just kind of fades away.
It gets bounced around because it is kind of in a borderline/grey area.

According to our Advice for Conspiracy Theory Supporters (http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php/86593-Advice-for-Conspiracy-Theory-Supporters), CT is mostly for an individual to advocate a CT. However, there are some exceptions to that (points 9 to 11) and this comes closest to # 11:

11. The CT forum may also be used for the critical analysis of websites that advocate specific astronomy and space related conspiracies. Such discussions should be limited to the specific claims of those websites and the scientific arguments against those claims. Such discussions are not an excuse to bash the claimants of such conspiracies.
The critical point of this is "critical analysis" and "specific claims" - it is not supposed to be for general ranting.

The other possible places for such threads would be Bad Astronomy in the Media, Small Media at Large, or Off-topic BABBling. The best particular location depends on the exact thread and there may be more than one acceptable answer.

chrlzs
2010-Jun-10, 10:55 PM
tenshu, the Interweb has made access to/for stupid people very easy. If you wish to spend the rest of your life correcting them, then feel free, and don't worry - there will be a seemingly endless supply. And because they can find other equally stupid people to support them (whereas in the real world they would normally find intelligent folk who will put them right), they LIKE the Interweb. And of course some are just trolling anyway.

My point/s? Just these:

1. If you want to find the truth, read books, find *real* experts, like *real* scientists (not people on the web who tell you they are), and go to credible sites, like *real* universities and do *real* research.

2. If you *do* choose to fight the ignorance (as I do, sometimes), don't be surprised by the depths these folk will descend to, don't get swayed by the stupidity, and.. have fun! Don't take it too seriously.

R.A.F.
2010-Jun-10, 11:15 PM
...don't be surprised by the depths these folk will descend to...

I know I shouldn't be, but I always am...surprised that is.

Gillianren
2010-Jun-10, 11:23 PM
^ your right i am a moron and a fool, now i await death by the order of kilopi for making another big mistake--;

That actually wasn't referring to you. It was referring to the commenters without an ounce of sense in their whole bodies, the ones causing the trouble in the first place.

peter eldergill
2010-Jun-11, 12:00 AM
http://xkcd.com/481/

THAT made me laugh

Thank you

Can someone tell me what "babby" is?

Ong
2010-Jun-11, 04:39 AM
"So people still believe Nasa is constantly lying to the public?"

I don't know about NASA "constantly lying to the public", but if they are constantly telling the 100% truth to the public it would be the first and only time in history that a government agency or politician did so.

Aik4on
2010-Jun-11, 07:30 AM
It always amuses me that CTs think governmental or quasi-governmental organisations are omnipotently powerful and capable of pulling off huge, audacious conspiracies. In my experience of working in the public sector, most orgs are barely able to keep their IT systems up and running and the photocopiers serviced on time.

HenrikOlsen
2010-Jun-11, 08:07 AM
^ your right i am a moron and a fool, now i await death by the order of kilopi for making another big mistake--;
You know that I was referring to the guy you were quoting in the op and people like him, right?

Swift
2010-Jun-11, 12:53 PM
"So people still believe Nasa is constantly lying to the public?"

I don't know about NASA "constantly lying to the public", but if they are constantly telling the 100% truth to the public it would be the first and only time in history that a government agency or politician did so.
These are serious questions: Do you really think that? Do you really think that no government agency in history has ever done so? Do you have any evidence to support that?

Do you think any human being in history has ever spoken the truth 100% of the time?

And even if true, that NASA for 50+ years has not always spoken 100% truth, what does that prove? You've proved that lies exist. That gives absolutely no evidence that any particular statement is a lie or that any specific event was described falsely.

You keep hinting that you think NASA is hiding something. Well, time to show your cards - state what you think they are lying about, and offer some evidence for it.

slang
2010-Jun-11, 03:15 PM
Can someone tell me what "babby" is?

You were one. Right after birth. It's one of those intentional misspellings that are popular on some sites.

AtomicDog
2010-Jun-11, 03:18 PM
When someone lies, it is to perpetuate their own self-interest. Considering the amount of tax money which would pour in their coffers for research and exploration, why doesn't NASA lie and say that there are alien bases on the Moon, that crop circles are evidence of ET activity, that the Mars face is a giant statue, and that alien spacecraft are zipping around every night abducting citizens and stealing cattle orifices?

novaderrik
2010-Jun-11, 03:30 PM
It always amuses me that CTs think governmental or quasi-governmental organisations are omnipotently powerful and capable of pulling off huge, audacious conspiracies. In my experience of working in the public sector, most orgs are barely able to keep their IT systems up and running and the photocopiers serviced on time.

they also think that those same agencies are totally incompetent and can't do anything right.. ever.. because they are too big and powerful.

Gillianren
2010-Jun-11, 04:56 PM
You were one. Right after birth. It's one of those intentional misspellings that are popular on some sites.

I believe it's also a Scots pronunciation.

peter eldergill
2010-Jun-11, 06:17 PM
You were one. Right after birth. It's one of those intentional misspellings that are popular on some sites.

I still don't get how it relates to the comic, though. (If you hover with your mouse over his comics, a "hidden" sentence/joke is revealed)

It says, "Man, I just wanted to know how babby was fomed"

http://xkcd.com/481/

Pete

Gillianren
2010-Jun-11, 06:58 PM
It's probably a reference to the terrible spelling you get, and the badly-phrased questions. I read one on a site once which must be a joke, where someone asks if his girlfriend can get pregnant again if they have sex while she's pregnant.

Grashtel
2010-Jun-11, 07:00 PM
I still don't get how it relates to the comic, though. (If you hover with your mouse over his comics, a "hidden" sentence/joke is revealed)

It says, "Man, I just wanted to know how babby was fomed"

http://xkcd.com/481/

Pete
Presumably that is in relation to what the guy who realised that he was a moron after having his post read back to him was asking about.

Torch2k
2010-Jun-11, 07:04 PM
. . . that alien spacecraft are zipping around every night abducting citizens and stealing cattle orifices?

They're stealing them? Ewwwwww ... that's even nastier than what I thought they were supposed to be doing.

kleindoofy
2010-Jun-11, 08:23 PM
... alien spacecraft are zipping around every night abducting citizens ...
Well, at least they're abducting citizens.

Wouldn't it be ironic if the aliens abducted aliens?

HenrikOlsen
2010-Jun-11, 09:06 PM
Or if they misread the memo and spent an entire night putting the cows in circles and mutilating the wheat.

Swift
2010-Jun-11, 09:14 PM
Or if they misread the memo and spent an entire night putting the cows in circles and mutilating the wheat.
Maybe they did misread the memo: cow circle (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_AGPFq30aqYY/Sw7hWaaaWtI/AAAAAAAAHp4/PKlOHG3ZsaA/s1600/8-cow+circle.jpg), cow circle 2 (http://randomphotog.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/cowcircles2.png)

Tenshu
2010-Jun-11, 09:52 PM
i feel like a bad person now for starting all this.

PetersCreek
2010-Jun-11, 10:04 PM
i feel like a bad person now for starting all this.

I don't really know if you're serious or not but in case you are...there's no need for melodrama. You have received only advice, instruction, and mild warning. You have not been infracted or threatened with suspension. The Order of Kilopi is not out to get you...and in fact, cannot get you.

Relax. Learn the rules. Post within them. You'll be fine.

KaiYeves
2010-Jun-11, 10:20 PM
http://xkcd.com/481/
Oh yes, we need that invention so much.

Van Rijn
2010-Jun-11, 11:29 PM
The Order of Kilopi is not out to get you...and in fact, cannot get you.


As an additional note, OOK is simply a post count. People who tend to post a lot on the board (and tend to post in a lot of threads) will be "Order of Kilopi." That's all.

Kinetic
2010-Jun-12, 10:09 AM
Maybe they did misread the memo: cow circle (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_AGPFq30aqYY/Sw7hWaaaWtI/AAAAAAAAHp4/PKlOHG3ZsaA/s1600/8-cow+circle.jpg), cow circle 2 (http://randomphotog.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/cowcircles2.png)

I believe!

Ong
2010-Jun-12, 11:35 PM
QUOTE=Swift;1744504]These are serious questions: Do you really think that? Do you really think that no government agency in history has ever done so? Do you have any evidence to support that?

Do you think any human being in history has ever spoken the truth 100% of the time?

Nah - but if you change "human being" to "politician" you can leave off the last four words.

And even if true, that NASA for 50+ years has not always spoken 100% truth, what does that prove? You've proved that lies exist. That gives absolutely no evidence that any particular statement is a lie or that any specific event was described falsely.

You keep hinting that you think NASA is hiding something.

You're reading that into what I just said before.

Well, time to show your cards - state what you think they are lying about, and offer some evidence for it.[/QUOTE

What, show my cards? I said what i said. That's all. You show your cards. Touchy about a spot of healthy skepticism, aren't we? Government employee?

And yeah, of course I "really think that", and what's more I could give you evidence about government agency/politician duplicity/lies up to your ears - but then you'd just PM me another one of your "infractions" or ban me saying I'm not allowed to mention anything outside of NASA and Apollo or whatever your official parameters are supposed to be (different for those who are not in the automatic amen corner, or course).

I went into Apollo stuff that I'm suspicious of to varying degrees on earlier posts, that is in between you and your buddies' bannings and infractions, which sort of breaks up the continuity a bit.

Many of you people here are technically astute and good debaters within the confines of your specialty - but when you lay it on that a feller's supposed to believe a government agency a priori because it is a govmt. agency, gimme a break. I know their modus operandi.

Here's the way I figure it, pal: When I hear or see something on the radio or the tv or from a politician's lips, I just switch it around 180 degrees and figure that I'm probably pretty close to the truth. That's the way rational people should react to habitual liars. Apollo? Guess I'll wait until I see some LEGITIMATE close up shots of the landing site - NOT a pixel with neatly drawn arrows pointing to it saying "landing site", "Rover tracks", "golf club"...

You know how to tell when a politician is lying? No? OK, I'll tell ya. When its lips are moving.

How many people here are on the govmt. payroll?

Actually, I'd probably be inclined to be LESS suspicious of the whole thing, but the unfair way you run this place, and the personalities of some of the honchos here JUST RUB ME THE WRONG WAY - make my suspicion antenna perk up, see.

George Ade, 19th century American humorist: "He had been kicked in the head by a mule when he was young, and after that he believed everything he read in the Sunday papers."

OK, who here has been kicked in the head by a mule?


Ong

Garrison
2010-Jun-13, 12:00 AM
Do I believe everything the government says? No. Do I believe the mountain of evidence that Apollo was real? Yes. An assumption that politicians and NASA are always lying is no more rational than assuming the opposite. If Ong you choose to provide no evidence to support your position whilst casually dismissing all evidence that contradicts it by airily insisting that government agencies lie don't expect a sympathetic hearing here. Nor does insulting people with comments like those in post #39 above. And if you insist on ignoring rules that are clearly laid out don't act surprised when you get punished for breaking them.
Now bearing that in mind do you have any actual theory to advance here?

Gillianren
2010-Jun-13, 12:07 AM
So if I'm getting this right, the belief here is that no politicians ever tell the truth? Ever? That every single politician, which covers thousands of people in the US alone, can be documented to be, to use the popular logic reference, a Cretan? If I went down the hill and around the lake, I could walk into the halls of my state government, if it were in session today, and find out that it's sunny out because all of them would tell me it's raining?

Or is "politicians always lie" itself a lie for effect and a dodge for not objectively examining evidence?

Van Rijn
2010-Jun-13, 02:05 AM
What, show my cards? I said what i said. That's all.

If so, it was an empty statement. The thread was started with quotes of someone who was making claims that NASA scientists were lying about 2012. Do you have any comments on that subject?



Many of you people here are technically astute and good debaters within the confines of your specialty - but when you lay it on that a feller's supposed to believe a government agency a priori because it is a govmt. agency, gimme a break.


Who, here, has made that claim?



Actually, I'd probably be inclined to be LESS suspicious of the whole thing, but the unfair way you run this place, and the personalities of some of the honchos here JUST RUB ME THE WRONG WAY - make my suspicion antenna perk up, see.


Heh. You might want to consider that many of your comments rub others the wrong way. Though I have to admit, I find your posts more amusing than annoying.

kleindoofy
2010-Jun-13, 02:24 AM
So if I'm getting this right, the belief here is that no politicians ever tell the truth? Ever? ...
So, if a politician stood up and said "I always lie," we would have a very complicated situation on our hands.

Does is mean he always tells the truth? If so, then he always lies. But that means ...

Oh dear.

Hmmm, so if Nasa were to say that they *didn't* go to the moon, then it would mean they did. And if they then confirmed that, yes thank you in fact they did go to the moon, then they didn't.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident." Spoken by politicians. So they're not self-evident? Or not truths? Or nobody's holding them? Or they're just not?

Oh dear.

Btw, I love posts written entirely in boldface. They're so, hmmm, exciting.

Obviousman
2010-Jun-13, 06:08 AM
I've investigated numerous aspects of all the American manned space programme, and I am happy that the landings are the truth.

I'm not a US citizen, nor am I am employed or receive funding in any way from any US agency (I just had to make that clear).

Ong, could you start by given me what you consider to be the most "telling" evidence - in your opinion - that shows NASA is lying about the Moon landings? Saying "politicians lie" or "governments lie" is not acceptable to me.

Thank you.

gwiz
2010-Jun-13, 09:49 AM
QUOTE=Swift;1744504]What, show my cards? I said what i said. That's all. You show your cards. Touchy about a spot of healthy skepticism, aren't we? Government employee?
Before I retired, I worked in the UK aerospace industry. Our technical library carried a lot of NASA stuff, it was very useful. You cannot bluff your way in engineering, otherwise your products will not work.

In my opinion, as a user of NASA information, you are very wide of the mark is describing it as lies.

captain swoop
2010-Jun-13, 11:35 AM
It seems to me this thread has veered far enough off topic and has had so little input from the OP that it can be closed.

As usual any requests for re opening should have a good reason and be reported with the triangle..
If the OP returns and wants to defend his position then report this post