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Memestream-X
2004-May-25, 08:32 PM
I am not certain that this subject has been discussed before, but it is interesting enough if you have not heard of it.

Every high school physical science class introduces the 4 states of matter, however for those interested, here is a fun site on the proposed 5th state.
I say proposed, because although I could be wrong, I have not heard of the hypothesis being accepted as theory as of yet.

http://www.5th-state-of-matter.com/sitemap.html


(snip)
Characteristics of bodies in the fifth state of matter:

1. They all have a filament-form.

2. They mostly have particles of higher energy than those of the plasma bodies.

3. In spite of the very high particle-energy, they all do not emit heat.

4. They all have a circular cross section and, therefore, a cylinder-body.

5. The parts (branches) of the filament are similar to the whole filament (Fig.9).

6. They can oscillate with supersonic frequencies (solar oscillation of 10.7 cm ?).

7. They move as gravity would not exist even in the very mouth of a black hole.

8. Their electric charge is either positive or negative. Overbalance is never neutral .

(end snip)

Your thoughts?

-Meme

wedgebert
2004-May-25, 09:17 PM
(edit: I believe this belongs in Against the Mainstream)

I believe the 5th state of matter is the one created when you cool a molecule down to near aboslute zero and it begins to act as a single atom. Or something like that.

There are a few problems that jump out at me from the website:


The Celsius scale did not have a coldest or hottest end (Fig.1). However, the Kelvin scale had a natural coldest end at 0 K.
Celsius is just Kelvin + 273.15.


The TV-beams, the ion-beams, sparks from electrified combs and clothes, X-ray tubes, lightnings (Fig.2) in our everyday life do not emit heat. If it would be of plasma, a lightning of 100 million Volt would emit heat with its very high particle energy of 108 eV as much as 1017 suns from its body of e.g. 3000 m (equ.1) !

Yes, Radio waves do not give off heat. However, when an object absorbs them, it causes the object's total energy to increase (and thus give off more heat).


6. They can oscillate with supersonic frequencies (solar oscillation of 10.7 cm ?).
I'm not even sure that this statement makes sense. Frequency is not measured in velocity and thus cannot be supersonic. Nor can a distance be considered supersonic.


7. They move as gravity would not exist even in the very mouth of a black hole.
That's plain wrong. All matter is affected by gravity. The jets coming from black holes are products of the immense velocities the matter in the accrecation accretion disks along with the shape of the gravity well (in the case of spinning black holes).

I'm sure others will respond to other major problems (like the no heat emission thing).

ToSeek
2004-May-25, 09:20 PM
The site claims that the solar corona and mass being ejected from the vicinity of black holes are mysteries, but they're not. (They're not fully understood, certainly, but well enough not to require hypothesizing a whole new state of matter.)

Andreas
2004-May-25, 10:00 PM
The Celsius scale did not have a coldest or hottest end (Fig.1). However, the Kelvin scale had a natural coldest end at 0 K.
Celsius is just Kelvin + 273.15.

Kelvin is just Celsius + 273.15 or Celsius is just Kelvin - 273.15.
:wink:

Gullible Jones
2004-May-25, 10:23 PM
Depending on how you look at things, the fifth state of matter could be either a Bose-Einstein condensate or a quarck-gluon plasma.

As for the website, it appears to be bunk - a conglomerate of unrelated stuff from superstring theory, meteorology, observations of Saggitarius A and the surrounding region, and stuff straight out of the author's imagination, supported by no evidence whatsoever.

(Saggitarius A is the designation of the object that is probably the center of our galaxy, a freakin' HUGE black hole. The area around it contains some weird stuff - big clouds of ionized hydrogen, filaments of plasma (a few of which are surrounded by a doughnut-shaped ring of ionized hydrogen), etc.)

wedgebert
2004-May-26, 02:01 AM
The Celsius scale did not have a coldest or hottest end (Fig.1). However, the Kelvin scale had a natural coldest end at 0 K.
Celsius is just Kelvin + 273.15.

Kelvin is just Celsius + 273.15 or Celsius is just Kelvin - 273.15.
:wink:

D'oh

tlbs101
2004-May-26, 03:19 PM
8. Their electric charge is either positive or negative. Overbalance is never neutral .
He also speaks of a current of charged particles, self-contained.

No "string" of this nature could hold itself together without the constant application of external energy -- and lots of it.

I worked on a proton accelerator at Los Alamos that produced a proton beam current of 100 mA, with proton energies in the 10 Mev range (largest of its kind, to date). Indeed, the beam power was enormous and it took a very large block of lead, mixed with other metals to "stop" the beam. The thing is, it also took an enormous amount of power (MegaWatts) just to keep the beam focused into a beam. Approximately 1/3 of the power applied to the accelerator was simply to focus the beam (1/3 was used to accelerate the protons, and 1/3 was waste heat).