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profloater
2013-Jul-03, 06:30 AM
75 years ago today, Mallard, a steam locomotive designed for the non stop london to Edinburgh run, achieved 126 mph, a record that still stands for a steam lkoco.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23137106

Perikles
2013-Jul-03, 09:20 AM
I remember spotting the Mallard in Leeds station in around 1958, when it was still in service.

profloater
2013-Jul-03, 10:34 AM
I heard with a full train they could do 117 mph on the straight stretches, 9 tons of coal for the run, I must check the distance 405 miles for the coal per mile figure, about 22 or 23 ish kg per mile, doesn't seem too bad for a whole train!

Trebuchet
2013-Jul-03, 02:25 PM
I have to confess my first thought on seeing the thread title was "David McCallum". Whose character likely appreciates the actual subject!

Swift
2013-Jul-03, 02:50 PM
I have to confess my first thought on seeing the thread title was "David McCallum". Whose character likely appreciates the actual subject!
I was thinking ducks. ;)

I got to ride behind Nickel Plate 765 (http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y461/Jonathan_Foise/IMG_3787_zps48b35cde.jpg) a few weeks ago on a fan trip. I have more pictures if people would like to see.

LookingSkyward
2013-Jul-03, 03:00 PM
We have an old Narrow gauge rail line near our house that does a little tourist ride. It's a pretty nice ride in good weather.

They have a steam engine (at least they did a couple years ago), but are not able to run it due to emissions standards.

lakewhatcomrailway.com

NEOWatcher
2013-Jul-03, 07:19 PM
I was thinking ducks. ;)
Me too.


I got to ride behind Nickel Plate 765 (http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y461/Jonathan_Foise/IMG_3787_zps48b35cde.jpg) a few weeks ago on a fan trip. I have more pictures if people would like to see.
At first, the picture made me think they brought it in for a special CVSR (http://www.cvsr.com/) event, but the orange stripe looks too high on the cars.

Too bad CVSR doesn't have their Mikado anymore.
It always had a backup diesel, but rumor has it that one time they needed the diesel, they had set the brakes on the steam.... All the way between Canton and Cleveland. Therefore they were left with a loco with flat drive wheels.

TJMac
2013-Jul-04, 04:22 PM
While I am not a "train geek", I am very much a large machinery geek, and absolutely fond of antique machinery.

A few months back, while at work, we heard an odd noise, very much unlike the normal train whistle we usually hear. (We are right next to a set of well used tracks.)

A couple of us go outside to take a look, and there is a huge plume of white smoke coming our direction. It was a bit alarming, since we didnt know the cause. A minute later, this engine goes by, pulling a few cars behind. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_Pacific_844

It had been on display downtown, and I totally missed seeing it. Good luck to catch it in action as it rolled out.

TJ

captain swoop
2013-Jul-05, 08:08 AM
I heard with a full train they could do 117 mph on the straight stretches, 9 tons of coal for the run, I must check the distance 405 miles for the coal per mile figure, about 22 or 23 ish kg per mile, doesn't seem too bad for a whole train!

It doesn't seem much until you are the guy thathas to shovel the 9 tons of coal into the firebox!

captain swoop
2013-Jul-05, 08:39 AM
We have one of the surviving A4 Pacifics in residence on the North Yorkshire Moore Railway. It was restored here in our workshops a few years ago.
http://www.nymr.co.uk/

At the moment the loco is at the National Railway Museum in York along with the Bittern, Union of South Africa, Dominion of Canada and Dweight D Eisenhower to celebrate the Mallard record.

We had the Bittern and Union of SOuth Africa steaming alongside the Union of South Africa for our 'LNER East Coast Mainline Festival'

Eisenhower and Dominion of Canade aren't in running condition, they have been shipped over the Atlantic from their respective museums for the celebration.
Dweight D Eisenhower looks strange, it seems to have been painted white on the valve gear and rounf inspection covers.

Good pictorial site for existing A4s
http://www.docbrown.info/docspics/nymr/locoA4pacifics.htm

HenrikOlsen
2013-Jul-05, 01:45 PM
It doesn't seem much until you are the guy that has to shovel the 9 tons of coal into the firebox!
For those engines, it's likely automatically fed, not manually shoveled.

KaiYeves
2013-Jul-05, 01:57 PM
I have to confess my first thought on seeing the thread title was "David McCallum". Whose character likely appreciates the actual subject!

I believe there was an episode where someone surprised him by saying their first throughout upon hearing his name was not ducks but the locomotive.

Perikles
2013-Jul-05, 02:30 PM
For those engines, it's likely automatically fed, not manually shoveled.In the record run in 1938, the fireman Thomas Bray would have been easily capable of shovelling 9 tons manually in 4 hours. I very much doubt that there was any form of assistance other than a shovel or two.

Trebuchet
2013-Jul-05, 03:27 PM
There's an older Top Gear episode in which the three hosts race from London to Edinburgh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Gear_Race_to_the_North) using the technologies of 50 years earlier -- James in a car (XK120), Richard on a motorcycle (Vincent Black Shadow), and Jeremy in the cab of a steam loco, shoveling the coal. The loco was Tornado (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LNER_Peppercorn_Class_A1_60163_Tornado), a recently (2008) completed replica.

Is there ANYTHING that doesn't have a Wikipedia article?

Swift
2013-Jul-05, 03:29 PM
Too bad CVSR doesn't have their Mikado anymore.
It always had a backup diesel, but rumor has it that one time they needed the diesel, they had set the brakes on the steam.... All the way between Canton and Cleveland. Therefore they were left with a loco with flat drive wheels.
Yeah, it just isn't nearly as much fun behind some old diesel.

I hadn't heard about the flat wheels, but that actually wasn't a rare problem in the age of steam; the tires (steel tires) on steam locomotives were actually replace fairly regularly.

My understanding as to why very few tourist lines run steam any longer is that the liability insurance is just way too expensive. And part of that unfortunately relates to this accident with a steam tractor in 2001 in Ohio (http://www.farmcollector.com/steam-engines/tragedy-at-medina-county-fairgrounds.aspx#axzz2YBYBd9Ql).

Swift
2013-Jul-05, 03:30 PM
Is there ANYTHING that doesn't have a Wikipedia article?
Nope, even anything (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anything).

profloater
2013-Jul-05, 03:45 PM
In the record run in 1938, the fireman Thomas Bray would have been easily capable of shovelling 9 tons manually in 4 hours. I very much doubt that there was any form of assistance other than a shovel or two. Yes the shoveling was manual, and reportedly the problem for the fireman was heat and vibration rather than the effort of moving the coal,

profloater
2013-Jul-05, 03:53 PM
Is there ANYTHING that doesn't have a Wikipedia article?
My hardest ever design job was to try to improve railway slack adjusters, Wiki is very slight on the subject. The slack adjuster takes up slack in the mechanical rods, and pays it out as required to maintain a fixed gap between brake pad and drum or disc, with no external energy source, just the overtravel of the actuator. It is in my opinion cleverer than the differential gear and rates with the epicyclic gearbox of Ford. Add the railway environment and you have a mechanism that has to work reliably and is a prime safety component. If you want a coffee break mental challenge, just try to imagine how it works, it has a rod both ends, no reference fixation, and it pays out or takes up every time it is used unless the gap is perfect. It is a mind bender but some un-named hero in the 19th century made it work.

NEOWatcher
2013-Jul-05, 06:07 PM
And part of that unfortunately relates to this accident with a steam tractor in 2001 in Ohio (http://www.farmcollector.com/steam-engines/tragedy-at-medina-county-fairgrounds.aspx#axzz2YBYBd9Ql).
I was near the Medina airport when that happened. I heard the boom and all the sirens afterwards. We already had decided not to go to the fair.

Swift
2013-Jul-05, 06:22 PM
I was near the Medina airport when that happened. I heard the boom and all the sirens afterwards. We already had decided not to go to the fair.
Wow, that's a little close for comfort.

HenrikOlsen
2013-Jul-06, 09:06 AM
Is there ANYTHING that doesn't have a Wikipedia article?
Me.

Trebuchet
2013-Jul-06, 01:50 PM
Me.

As long as you aren't fussy about spelling.... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henrik_Olesen)

captain swoop
2013-Jul-06, 02:02 PM
Mechanical Firing wasn't used on British Locomotives, there were some experiments but the fireboxes didn't get anywhere near the size of those on US locomotives and it wasn't cost effective. British Rail Standard Class 9 Locomotives (Evening Star Class) were just about at the limit of human firing though.

I think in the US there aren't that many preserved steam locomotives so the running costs tend to be high.
In the UK because the railway companies had been donating notable locomotives to the National Collection since the early 20thc and then steam was scrapped very quickly in the 60s (some of the BR Standard class locomotives were barely run in) there are lots of preserved examples.
There are something over a thousand locomotives on various 'Heritage Railways' most of them in running condition. There is an entire industry to support them, specialist engineering companies and the Heritage Railways own workshops keep costs down. Plus when the railways were 'rationalised' in the 60s entire branch lines purchesed by preservation trusts with all track, signals etc in place.

On the NYMR we have over a hundred full time staff to run the railway as well as an army of volunteers. Grosmont Shed has 30 odd full time engineering staff. We do complete rebuilds and running work. Wed can also send parts or complete locomotives out to specialist companies for work. At the moment there are at least 4 or 5 brand new replicas of locomotives that were never preserved being built.
It's a huge industry in the UK. Big outfits like ours or the Severn Valley, Great Central etc have 5 or 6 locomotives in steam on any given day in the summer to run the timetable.
There are 108 Operating Railways and 60 'Steam Centres' (workshops, museums and such that have live steam)
Total route mileage is 536 miles with 411 stations.

Heritage railways earned around 92 million last year and directly employ 2,200 people and also benefit from the work of 18,529 volunteers.
See more at: http://www.heritagerailways.com/visits_about.php#sthash.zvD4dgXj.dpuf

profloater
2013-Jul-06, 03:27 PM
That is very good news, I did not realise how big steam is and we can experience that unique, redolent mix of oil and steam. I always wanted to find a Stanley Steamer (car) whose owners could fire up the boiler, walk away and then whistle, the Stanley would slowly come toward them!

Swift
2013-Jul-07, 03:31 AM
There are something over a thousand locomotives on various 'Heritage Railways' most of them in running condition. There is an entire industry to support them, specialist engineering companies and the Heritage Railways own workshops keep costs down. Plus when the railways were 'rationalised' in the 60s entire branch lines purchesed by preservation trusts with all track, signals etc in place.

Wow, that is absolutely awesome CS, I didn't know things were anywhere close to that scale. Yes, what is preserved in the US pales in comparison.

One of these years I'm going to have to do a UK holiday with my wife and we'll have to do some serious railfanning.

captain swoop
2013-Jul-07, 10:04 AM
On the Heritage Railway site I linked to the header picture is on 'my' line the NYMR, it is a train leaving Whitby Harbour Station and passing under the old Viaduct on the Whitby - Scarborough line.

We have over 30 miles of track between Whitby through the North Yorkshire Moors and forest to Pickering. We just recently got running rights over the traack from our station at Grosmont where it has a junction with the 'proper' railway from WHitby to Teesside. Getting into Whitby has increased our number of passengers considerably.
We run full 8 and 9 coach trains plus our incline up from Grosmont to the next station at Goathland is o ne of the few places a big mainline loco can get a proper workout. :)

Goathland Station was used as Hogwarts Station in the Harry Potter films. It is also the setting for the long running 60s set nostalgic police series 'Heartbeat'.

NEOWatcher
2013-Jul-09, 05:45 PM
Wow, that is absolutely awesome CS, I didn't know things were anywhere close to that scale. Yes, what is preserved in the US pales in comparison.
I didn't think it was such a large scale either. Is it a resurgance?

Growing up, I remember the Cedar Point Railway (https://www.cedarpoint.com/rides/Family-Rides/Cedar-Point-and-Lake-Erie-Railroad) being one of the last remaining steam trains in the country. But; I was young, so the full description probably didn't click into place. But; it does illustrate how rare it was to see one.

I was in Europe in 1970 and amazed at seeing steam locomotives in regular use.

captain swoop
2013-Jul-09, 09:06 PM
Not a resurgence, a lot of the Heritage Lines started in the 60s as the old Branch Lines were closed by BR.
Some are more recent. There are two neighboring Heritage railways on the Old Great Central line, they are about to be joined together when a missing bridge is replaced across the West Coast Main Line. It will give them about a 40 mile run and they will amalgamate in to one outfit. They are on an old Main Line as well so double tracked.

New locomotives being built is to fill gaps in the preserved stuff. A lot of what was preserved was big passenger locomotives and mainline stuff. A lot of heritage lines are more suited to smaller less glam locomotives that didn't tend to get preserved.