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kucharek
2004-Nov-27, 06:56 PM
Sorry, we get 'em a little late here in Germany...
I saw today the "The Expanse" episode of Enterprise. One thing was odd. There is one scene where they stand near the place where Tripp's sister had lived. There is that swath of destruction, a wide, deep trench. Now, it is said this is Florida. Now, Wikipedia says the highest pont of Fl. is 105 meters, so if you would cut a trench several hundred meters deep through it, I expect it to be filled with seawater. There was some water on the ground, but pretty much in the deep.

Did I get something wrong or is this really a case of bad geography?

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Nov-27, 07:08 PM
Sorry, we get 'em a little late here in Germany...
I saw today the "The Expanse" episode of Enterprise. One thing was odd. There is one scene where they stand near the place where Tripp's sister had lived. There is that swath of destruction, a wide, deep trench. Now, it is said this is Florida. Now, Wikipedia says the highest pont of Fl. is 105 meters, so if you would cut a trench several hundred meters deep through it, I expect it to be filled with seawater. There was some water on the ground, but pretty much in the deep.

Did I get something wrong or is this really a case of bad geography?

Eh

It might be a little ...

But, in this Case, I'm Wiling to Accept it, on Presentation Grounds.

I mean, what's More Satisfying, a New Water Way, or The Proverbial, Scorched Earth?

Humphrey
2004-Nov-27, 10:30 PM
Its bad Geography. The water table here is at most a few feet undwerground. They have to bring in several generators to pump water if they are building anything that gets dug into the ground.

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Nov-28, 01:15 AM
Its bad Geography. The water table here is at most a few feet undwerground. They have to bring in several generators to pump water if they are building anything that gets dug into the ground.

All True.

But, the Question Stands, which Situation, is More, um, Graphically Pleasing?

kucharek
2004-Nov-28, 08:48 AM
Its bad Geography. The water table here is at most a few feet undwerground. They have to bring in several generators to pump water if they are building anything that gets dug into the ground.

All True.

But, the Question Stands, which Situation, is More, um, Graphically Pleasing?

There are enough places in the US where you can dig a deep trench and kill lots of people without having to install pumps to keep it dry. There was no need to use Florida, thus I count it as unneccessary bad geography.

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Nov-28, 03:21 PM
Its bad Geography. The water table here is at most a few feet undwerground. They have to bring in several generators to pump water if they are building anything that gets dug into the ground.

All True.

But, the Question Stands, which Situation, is More, um, Graphically Pleasing?

There are enough places in the US where you can dig a deep trench and kill lots of people without having to install pumps to keep it dry. There was no need to use Florida, thus I count it as unneccessary bad geography.

True

It was Probably done to Include Trip.

His Accent places him Firmly in the South, and I think it had already been mentioned, Exactly where he was from.

Alas, sometimes Geography must Bend to The Wishes of The Cinematographer, that's Show Biz, Baby!

kucharek
2004-Nov-28, 03:30 PM
It was Probably done to Include Trip.

His Accent places him Firmly in the South, and I think it had already been mentioned, Exactly where he was from.

That's the bad thing with dubbed versions that such things are completely missing.

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Nov-28, 03:40 PM
It was Probably done to Include Trip.

His Accent places him Firmly in the South, and I think it had already been mentioned, Exactly where he was from.

That's the bad thing with dubbed versions that such things are completely missing.

True ...

But, to anyone Even Remotely Familiar, with American Demographics; his Face places him Rather Firmly in the South, as Well, Heck, he's a Dead Ringer, for The President!

Tobin Dax
2004-Nov-28, 10:01 PM
Its bad Geography. The water table here is at most a few feet undwerground. They have to bring in several generators to pump water if they are building anything that gets dug into the ground.

All True.

But, the Question Stands, which Situation, is More, um, Graphically Pleasing?

There are enough places in the US where you can dig a deep trench and kill lots of people without having to install pumps to keep it dry. There was no need to use Florida, thus I count it as unneccessary bad geography.


True

It was Probably done to Include Trip.

His Accent places him Firmly in the South, and I think it had already been mentioned, Exactly where he was from.

Alas, sometimes Geography must Bend to The Wishes of The Cinematographer, that's Show Biz, Baby!

Actually, that was the first time it was said that Trip was from Florida. I saw an interview with the actor where he said he made the comment to the people in charge, "Florida? I haven't been doing Florida." (With regard to the accent, and he was right. His accent was a little deeper south than that.)
[edit to place response outside of all quotes #-o ]

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Nov-29, 02:12 AM
Its bad Geography. The water table here is at most a few feet undwerground. They have to bring in several generators to pump water if they are building anything that gets dug into the ground.

All True.

But, the Question Stands, which Situation, is More, um, Graphically Pleasing?

There are enough places in the US where you can dig a deep trench and kill lots of people without having to install pumps to keep it dry. There was no need to use Florida, thus I count it as unneccessary bad geography.


True

It was Probably done to Include Trip.

His Accent places him Firmly in the South, and I think it had already been mentioned, Exactly where he was from.

Alas, sometimes Geography must Bend to The Wishes of The Cinematographer, that's Show Biz, Baby!

Actually, that was the first time it was said that Trip was from Florida. I saw an interview with the actor where he said he made the comment to the people in charge, "Florida? I haven't been doing Florida." (With regard to the accent, and he was right. His accent was a little deeper south than that.)
[edit to place response outside of all quotes #-o ]

Further South than Florida?

Isn't that, The Carribean?

Of course, as My Brother likes to say, "Florida is so far south, it's North."

The Supreme Canuck
2004-Nov-29, 03:18 AM
Puerto Rico, maybe? 8-[

Humphrey
2004-Nov-29, 06:11 AM
For those of you who do not know: Florida, in speech and in culture is a north-east state except for some rural areas and the panhandel. ITs commonly said that the further south in Florida, the further north you go.

Maksutov
2004-Nov-29, 06:48 AM
For those of you who do not know: Florida, in speech and in culture is a north-east state except for some rural areas and the panhandel. ITs commonly said that the further south in Florida, the further north you go.
It's also the only Northeastern state whose population has an average age of 85.

Where the Xindi messed up was not cutting along the Georgia and Alabama borders, and then moving the whole thing to a position right off Long Island. Perhaps they actually considered this, but realized no one would notice...

mid
2004-Nov-29, 02:33 PM
But, to anyone Even Remotely Familiar, with American Demographics; his Face places him Rather Firmly in the South, as Well, Heck, he's a Dead Ringer, for The President!

George W. Bush (http://www.whitehouse.gov/president/gwbbio.html) was born in New Haven, Conneticut, even if he grew up in Texas. Since facial features are genetically inherited, I'll also mention that his Dad (http://www.whitehouse.gov/history/presidents/gb41.html) was born in Milton, Massachusetts.

Not particularly Southern, then.

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Nov-29, 05:46 PM
But, to anyone Even Remotely Familiar, with American Demographics; his Face places him Rather Firmly in the South, as Well, Heck, he's a Dead Ringer, for The President!

George W. Bush (http://www.whitehouse.gov/president/gwbbio.html) was born in New Haven, Conneticut, even if he grew up in Texas. Since facial features are genetically inherited, I'll also mention that his Dad (http://www.whitehouse.gov/history/presidents/gb41.html) was born in Milton, Massachusetts.

Not particularly Southern, then.

That I did not Know ...

Conner Trineer's Eyes, still freak me out, though!

Decromin
2004-Nov-30, 11:27 PM
i wonder why florida? I mean, other than the Tripp story point, there would surely be better targets to attack than florida ....

Avatar28
2004-Dec-01, 12:19 AM
i wonder why florida? I mean, other than the Tripp story point, there would surely be better targets to attack than florida ....

Maybe they've got a thing against old people?

tjm220
2004-Dec-01, 08:56 PM
Maybe it's all the Canadian vacationers / retirees that offsets the sourthern speak?

Jobe
2004-Dec-02, 02:51 AM
on the topic of 'why attack florida'-: More importantly, why attack America? Most of the earth is not soil of the USA, and since it seemed to be a random attack, chances are it would have hit somewhere else.

Oh wait, I forgot Enterprise is an American show and thus we have the United States of Earth. derp!

This reminds me of futurama! Another excellent US Tv program

Leela: Look, I know there are no car chases, but this is important. One of these two men will become president of the world.

Fry: What do we care? We live in the United States.

Leela: The United States is part of the world.

Fry: Wow, I have been gone a long time.

jt-3d
2004-Dec-02, 09:47 AM
If I recall the beam continued on through Cuba and down into South America before it ran out of power or crashed or what ever. Happy now?

A Thousand Pardons
2004-Dec-02, 11:01 AM
How do we know the trench was several hundred meters deep?

Groundwater levels in Florida (http://www.state.fl.us/nwfwmd/hydrology/ground/levels/gwlevels.htm) vary. Some places, some times, it's over a hundred feet down.

It's hard to predict things about the future, too. I know. :)

JonnyWishbone
2004-Dec-02, 12:07 PM
If I were going to go by Trek technobabble, I'd say they hit Florida because it was the first place the 'probe' could hit when it came out of the transwarp thingamajig that brought it from the Expanse to Earth orbit in a few hours rather than six weeks. Any longer in its approach and Earth's defense system (which, from Star Trek history, we know to be one ship named Enterprise and a bunch of guys named Joe) would have sprung into action and shot the probe down, so it fired at the first industrialized/populated target it could hit in the time it had to target and the time it had to fire (which, based on the visual, wasn't that long -- the probe stopped firing and entered the Earth's atmosphere pretty quickly, which I guess means it was supposed to be moving toward Earth for the entire time it was firing. If it were in orbit, I don't know why it would crashland in Asia so quickly, although Star Trek orbits are fearsomely hard to maintain).

Give the 'size' of the trench shown, the water question is a good one, but whoever pointed out that a wasteland was more visually impressive than a really large canal had a very good point. Given the Xindi's hatred of retirees, hitting Arizona might have solved the water problem and still given us a wasteland.

Cheers, Jon

ZaphodBeeblebrox
2004-Dec-02, 01:35 PM
If I were going to go by Trek technobabble, I'd say they hit Florida because it was the first place the 'probe' could hit when it came out of the transwarp thingamajig that brought it from the Expanse to Earth orbit in a few hours rather than six weeks. Any longer in its approach and Earth's defense system (which, from Star Trek history, we know to be one ship named Enterprise and a bunch of guys named Joe) would have sprung into action and shot the probe down, so it fired at the first industrialized/populated target it could hit in the time it had to target and the time it had to fire (which, based on the visual, wasn't that long -- the probe stopped firing and entered the Earth's atmosphere pretty quickly, which I guess means it was supposed to be moving toward Earth for the entire time it was firing. If it were in orbit, I don't know why it would crashland in Asia so quickly, although Star Trek orbits are fearsomely hard to maintain).

Give the 'size' of the trench shown, the water question is a good one, but whoever pointed out that a wasteland was more visually impressive than a really large canal had a very good point. Given the Xindi's hatred of retirees, hitting Arizona might have solved the water problem and still given us a wasteland.

Cheers, Jon

Um, Who would have Noticed?

And, thanks about the Trench Comment, sometimes it's Helpful, When your Brother's a Flim Major ...

Humphrey
2004-Dec-02, 05:24 PM
How do we know the trench was several hundred meters deep?

Groundwater levels in Florida (http://www.state.fl.us/nwfwmd/hydrology/ground/levels/gwlevels.htm) vary. Some places, some times, it's over a hundred feet down.

It's hard to predict things about the future, too. I know. :)Thats the panhandel. Thats still affected by the appalatians. If i remember right the beam went right down the center of the state.

A Thousand Pardons
2004-Dec-02, 06:11 PM
That makes sense, if it's going to hit Cuba, but I chose that part because it is centered on the highest point in Florida, mentioned in the OP. Still, how do we know what it's like, in the future. Maybe the water table has been turned to gel. :)

Bob B.
2004-Dec-02, 09:22 PM
I agree with the ground water issue, but I think the trench would have filled even more quickly with sea water. As I recall, the trench cut all the way through Florida and into the sea. There would have been nothing to stop the sea from rushing in from the south.

JonnyWishbone
2004-Dec-02, 10:22 PM
I think that's right, Bob B. -- the beam cuts all the way out into the ocean at the end of its track.

Cheers, Jon

Maksutov
2004-Dec-02, 10:48 PM
Here's what Britton Hill/Lakewood Park looked like last year.


http://img35.exs.cx/img35/5060/25-BrittonHill12003.th.jpg (http://img35.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img35&image=25-BrittonHill12003.jpg)


http://img35.exs.cx/img35/8881/1a-BrittonHill22003.th.jpg (http://img35.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img35&image=1a-BrittonHill22003.jpg)

No sign of any gel, pretty solid looking for sand!

A Thousand Pardons
2004-Dec-03, 11:16 AM
No sign of any gel
It's in the future. The gel comes in a few years, when Florida leases its statewide naming rights and becomes the state of Pudding Pops.

Tobin Dax
2004-Dec-03, 07:22 PM
No sign of any gel
It's in the future. The gel comes in a few years, when Florida leases its statewide naming rights and becomes the state of Pudding Pops.

Will Bill Cosby be elected governor? :D 8)

Humphrey
2004-Dec-10, 05:27 AM
I thought we would go to the fiber in a can first,