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Tuckerfan
2005-Jan-12, 05:59 AM
That's me on the left, holding the other end of the shank. (http://www.pctcast.net/CRW_0009.jpg) In case you're wondering, that's molten steel at around 3000F in the ladle. I some times do that eight or more times a day. Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me? ;)

Nicolas
2005-Jan-12, 10:16 AM
That man on the right back in black is too cliché 8)

8 or less cups a day tough?? Ever thought about how many cups a cantine waitress has to do a day???? :D

Seriously, what do you have to do in the meantime, I assume you don't just stand there and wait untill the next cup is ready?

Candy
2005-Jan-12, 01:46 PM
OMG. I bet you weigh two pounds at the end of the day. :o

Amadeus
2005-Jan-12, 01:50 PM
There you are in all your thermal gear and the guy next to you is just wearing a black T-shirt!

I think he has a tougher than you m8!

Nergal
2005-Jan-12, 02:27 PM
Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me? ;)

I have a tougher job than you. :^o

There, I said it. Just don't ask me if I really believe it :D

Gmann
2005-Jan-12, 02:40 PM
My job is mentally tougher...my boss has a 6th grade education, and is proud of it. My shift manager is better educated, but a bigger idiot.

(yes, last night we did everything bass ackwards)

gethen
2005-Jan-12, 03:07 PM
Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me?
I don't have pictures, but yesterday my spouse spent most of his day with his arm up a cow's back end (pregnancy checks) and then got kicked trying to replace a cow's uterus that had been ejected during calving.
He has a lovely 8" diameter bruise to prove it.

Colt
2005-Jan-12, 03:09 PM
:o

Amadeus
2005-Jan-12, 03:11 PM
Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me?
I don't have pictures, but yesterday my spouse spent most of his day with his arm up a cow's back end (pregnancy checks) and then got kicked trying to replace a cow's uterus that had been ejected during calving.
He has a lovely 8" diameter bruise to prove it.

Could worse he could be Rebbeca Loos.....
Those who know, know too much. Those who don't know, don't ask :-&

kucharek
2005-Jan-12, 03:53 PM
Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me?
I don't have pictures, but yesterday my spouse spent most of his day with his arm up a cow's back end (pregnancy checks) and then got kicked trying to replace a cow's uterus that had been ejected during calving.
Uteri could be ejected during calving!?

You not only learn something new every day on the BABB, you learn something new every day on the BABB you'd never imagined to learn on the BABB... :o

Nicolas
2005-Jan-12, 03:56 PM
Could worse he could be Rebbeca Loos.....

Some cows are black and white, so are some footballs, I see no other link?

N C More
2005-Jan-12, 03:59 PM
You not only learn something new every day on the BABB, you learn something new every day on the BABB you'd never imagined to learn on the BABB... :o

It's called uterine prolapse and it can happen to humans too. At birth my son weighed in at over 10 lbs and let's just say it was a good thing I was able to have immediate surgery! Anybody care to beat "tougher" than that?

Amadeus
2005-Jan-12, 04:03 PM
Could worse he could be Rebbeca Loos.....

Some cows are black and white, so are some footballs, I see no other link?

Be gratefull that you don't...... what some people will do for fame.....
The horror :o

Maksutov
2005-Jan-12, 04:07 PM
Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me?
I don't have pictures, but yesterday my spouse spent most of his day with his arm up a cow's back end (pregnancy checks) and then got kicked trying to replace a cow's uterus that had been ejected during calving.
He has a lovely 8" diameter bruise to prove it.

Could worse he could be Rebbeca Loos.....
Those who know, know too much. Those who don't know, don't ask :-&
That's just for pigs... :roll:

Fram
2005-Jan-12, 04:11 PM
You not only learn something new every day on the BABB, you learn something new every day on the BABB you'd never imagined to learn on the BABB... :o

It's called uterine prolapse and it can happen to humans too. At birth my son weighed in at over 10 lbs and let's just say it was a good thing I was able to have immediate surgery! Anybody care to beat "tougher" than that?

It's tougher than anything I ever had to endure, but it isn't really a job, is it? 8-[

Argos
2005-Jan-12, 04:12 PM
Contrary to popular opinion, yours is the most ancient profession. Cool.

Maksutov
2005-Jan-12, 04:13 PM
You wouldn't happen to work at Hoeganaes Corp. by any chance?

N C More
2005-Jan-12, 04:15 PM
It's tougher than anything I ever had to endure, but it isn't really a job, is it? 8-[

Good point! However, I have had to raise him for the last 16 years. He's now 6' 3" and wears a mens size 15 shoe and a 52 suit jacket. Care to estimate my grocery bill?

Nergal
2005-Jan-12, 04:17 PM
I don't have pictures, but yesterday my spouse spent most of his day with his arm up a cow's back end (pregnancy checks) and then got kicked trying to replace a cow's uterus that had been ejected during calving.

Tangentally related: An old aquaintence (boyfriend of my sister's friend) had a job de-nutting and/or castrating bulls. I still cringe in symapthetic pain whenever his name is mentioned. I imagine the occupational hazards from the bulls isn't small either. 8-
More"]t's called uterine prolapse and it can happen to humans too. At birth my son weighed in at over 10 lbs and let's just say it was a good thing I was able to have immediate surgery! Anybody care to beat "tougher" than that?

No man who's ever been in a room when his wife gave birth or had a c-section (I include myself in both categories) will ever sanely dismiss how tough childbirth is.

Amadeus
2005-Jan-12, 04:27 PM
You not only learn something new every day on the BABB, you learn something new every day on the BABB you'd never imagined to learn on the BABB... :o

It's called uterine prolapse and it can happen to humans too. At birth my son weighed in at over 10 lbs and let's just say it was a good thing I was able to have immediate surgery! Anybody care to beat "tougher" than that?

It's tougher than anything I ever had to endure, but it isn't really a job, is it? 8-[

If you start running now m8 you might just escape the wrath that is surely heading your way!
:D

Thumper
2005-Jan-12, 04:29 PM
No man who's ever been in a room when his wife gave birth or had a c-section (I include myself in both categories) will ever sanely dismiss how tough childbirth is.

Ditto ^

Daughter at birth 10lbs 2oz
Wife before pregnancy 5ft 2in 125lbs
:o

Maksutov
2005-Jan-12, 04:40 PM
You not only learn something new every day on the BABB, you learn something new every day on the BABB you'd never imagined to learn on the BABB... :o

It's called uterine prolapse and it can happen to humans too. At birth my son weighed in at over 10 lbs and let's just say it was a good thing I was able to have immediate surgery! Anybody care to beat "tougher" than that?
My son decided that he wanted to enter the world neither by head nor breech, but essentially sideways. The doctors and nurses had to clamp onto his head to pull him into the proper position. My heart probably raced harder during those moments than any sprint I've run, ever.

Fortunately he made it OK, although his head was (like most infants) somewhat deformed for while, until the clamping effects subsided and natural symmetry took over.

The most ironic thing was, his mother (my wife) told me the whole thing was rather effortless for her, and her only complaint was being exposed to all those strangers.

Funny how she changed her tune when it was time for the divorce preliminaries.

NC, no wonder your kids, especially your son, turned out to be height advantaged! My utmost respect to you!

Captain Kidd
2005-Jan-12, 04:47 PM
Ditto with Tumper

Son: 9 lbs 3 oz
Wife very similar to his.

His head was too big and the ended up doing a C-section. There's not much as heart-wrenching as entering the OR (you have to wait outside during prep) and seeing your wife crucified to a table.

N C More
2005-Jan-12, 04:58 PM
You not only learn something new every day on the BABB, you learn something new every day on the BABB you'd never imagined to learn on the BABB... :o

It's called uterine prolapse and it can happen to humans too. At birth my son weighed in at over 10 lbs and let's just say it was a good thing I was able to have immediate surgery! Anybody care to beat "tougher" than that?

It's tougher than anything I ever had to endure, but it isn't really a job, is it? 8-[

If you start running now m8 you might just escape the wrath that is surely heading your way!
:D

He he...no "wrath", I'll just send him over to eat at Fram's house for the next week or so! :wink:

Maksutov
2005-Jan-12, 05:03 PM
That's me on the left, holding the other end of the shank. (http://www.pctcast.net/CRW_0009.jpg) In case you're wondering, that's molten steel at around 3000F in the ladle. I some times do that eight or more times a day. Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me? ;)
Well, perhaps, but...

Spend some time in a heat treating facility with no air circulation, during the summer with humidity near 100% and the ambient temperature where you work at near 120° F hour after hour. Plus this was pre-OSHA, so all the company did for you was provide salt pills.

That's one example re being uncomfortable.

Then there's pressure.

Try working in an environment where you're directly responsible for the reliability of a power unit that will propel and provide energy for a fast attack boat crewed by 136 submariners, who are all dead men if the power unit fails. Due to classification restraints, about all I can say re the power unit is that it is nuclear and is about 2 1/2 stories high. When shipped, it goes in a railroad flatcar followed by two boxcars. The boxcars contain the certification paperwork, most of which carries your signature on it.

One xmas eve, after receiving a phone call, I had to tell my son that Dad wouldn't be home for a while. There was a problem with a power unit that had to fixed immediately. After an engineering session to figure out how to correct the problem, the rest of the time was spent performing the repairs, with about 20 million dollars and a crew's safety hanging in the balance (as was one of the welders performing a repair).

When I got back home on the 26th, after picking him up at the babysitter's, my son was treated to an extra special xmas: he got the mountain bike he had been dreaming of for the last five months!

gethen
2005-Jan-12, 05:46 PM
In no way was my post intended to hijack this thread into a discussion of childbirth. (Been there, done that, 3 times.) I was just responding to the question about tough jobs. With that in mind, I once had a job in high school working as a carhop. If you don't know what that means, you're much younger than I am and have no idea what a degrading job it was. :wink:

Maksutov
2005-Jan-12, 06:09 PM
In no way was my post intended to hijack this thread into a discussion of childbirth. (Been there, done that, 3 times.) I was just responding to the question about tough jobs. With that in mind, I once had a job in high school working as a carhop. If you don't know what that means, you're much younger than I am and have no idea what a degrading job it was. :wink:
I know. I'm old enough. I worked in the "service industry" for a while, during HS and college.

One of the things my late fiancée told me that I treasure concerned how I treated folks such as checkout persons, waiters and waitresses, etc. She said she really liked how I treated them as people, as equals, and didn't give them a hard time based on some sort of notion of "social superiority".

All I could tell her was that I always tried to treat people decently and with respect, unless they did something to prove that they didn't deserve that respect. It was just my nature.

I guess the reason she really appreciated this was that she had been a waitress. Some of the stories she told me about the pigs she had to deal with were very upsetting. Why can't people realize that, if the job a person happens to have isn't a top executive or engineering position, etc., that it doesn't mean that they are any less human or deserving of the respect that any person should be entitled to.

BTW, if you'd like to work for me, snobs and snots need not apply.

Tuckerfan
2005-Jan-12, 10:28 PM
My job is mentally tougher...my boss has a 6th grade education, and is proud of it. My shift manager is better educated, but a bigger idiot.

(yes, last night we did everything bass ackwards)Meet my supervisor, Pete Puma. (http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//Forum1/HTML/008330.html)

Tuckerfan
2005-Jan-12, 10:50 PM
That man on the right back in black is too cliché 8)

8 or less cups a day tough?? Ever thought about how many cups a cantine waitress has to do a day???? :D

Seriously, what do you have to do in the meantime, I assume you don't just stand there and wait untill the next cup is ready?It's not 8 cups a day, it's 16 cups a heat, 8 heats a day. Each ladle holds about 50 lbs of molten steel. The furnace, that Big John's poking with a stick (actually a piece of rebar) holds 800 lbs of steel at a time. As for what I do when I'm not pouring steel, I work in the machine shop. See the above link about my supervisor for how much fun that is. Oh, and that photo was taken in July, and the temps inside the suit are probably around 150 F or so.

Kebsis
2005-Jan-12, 11:45 PM
Just a few weeks ago, a guy doing the same job I do (on a peir further south) got a hook lodged in his head and fell into the water. But they got him out and he's alive last I heard.

Maksutov
2005-Jan-13, 07:12 AM
My job is mentally tougher...my boss has a 6th grade education, and is proud of it. My shift manager is better educated, but a bigger idiot.

(yes, last night we did everything bass ackwards)Meet my supervisor, Pete Puma. (http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//Forum1/HTML/008330.html)
What kind of management structure (if any) does the company have? Or is "Pete" being "family" enough to exempt him from normal rules of conduct? Sounds as though that's the case.

So you make your own castings and then machine them? Must be a lot of short-run specialty type jobs. Sounds potentially frustrating in another way, i.e., if you find a void or features that won't clean up on one of your own castings, whom do you blame? :wink:

If "Pete"'s a fixture and untouchable, then your plan to move on as soon as things are optimal is a good idea. Otherwise you'll spend months and years banging your head against a wall, and eventually will be made a scapegoat by "Pete". Those sort of persons may appear to be dumb, and in many cases are dumb, but they usually manage to survive off of instincts and cunning. Plus it would be good to working somewhere else when your current employer goes out of business, which appears to be inevitable.

BTW, one of the posters on the linked thread mentioned using your ideas and creations as a negotiating chip if you are seeking a raise or perhaps a promotion. He said these things were your "intellectual property". It would be good to check all the paperwork you signed when taking the job to see if there is a standard intellectual property release in there somewhere. This is a "boilerplate", but very legally binding, form that says, in short, that anything you invent and any other ideas you implement in the course of your employment, belong to the company.

Use of this form is standard practice in almost all companies. But, who knows, in a company as poorly managed as where you currently work, HR (or whoever fills that role) may have forgotten about it or may not even be aware of such a thing.

One question: are your products finished components? Or are they shipped to your customer for additional/final machining, etc. If the latter, then that might explain how "Pete"'s been getting away with creating crap for all these years. If the former, then that might explain why the company is on the verge of bankruptcy.

Good luck!

PS: if someone attempted to transfer those "blue-ears" into my inspection department, they'd find, in short order, that their ears would be even bluer, being out in the cold outdoors, looking in.

Nicolas
2005-Jan-13, 10:53 AM
It's not 8 cups a day, it's 16 cups a heat, 8 heats a day. Each ladle holds about 50 lbs of molten steel. The furnace, that Big John's poking with a stick (actually a piece of rebar) holds 800 lbs of steel at a time. As for what I do when I'm not pouring steel, I work in the machine shop

OK I get it. That "metal pouring" job has some secrets to me. At least I know now what your job consists of (and it doesn't sound like waiting all day :)). Now my second question is WHY. Why are you standing there with two men pouring metal. Can't this very easily be done automatically? (I don't want you to lose your job :) ).

Or is it that you constantly have to watch the stream of metal to see if everything looks correct, so automatisation would be very hard? So I'm not asking why you are pouring steel, but why you are doing it by hand.

zebo-the-fat
2005-Jan-13, 12:59 PM
I know a guy who worked in a small foundry, he was pouring a ladel of molten aluminium alloy into a mould, he slipped and poured most of it into his boot. Nasty :(

captain swoop
2005-Jan-13, 01:16 PM
Hey, that's nice you got a miniature steelworks :wink:

Amadeus
2005-Jan-13, 01:18 PM
I've got a scar on my hand from some lead casting I did as a kid.

I got this "games workshop" make our own lead figures kit.
Pretty cool stuff I made whole armies of orcs etc, then one day I didn't notice that the mold was wet and a steam bubble errupted and I splashed molten lead on my hand.

Maksutov
2005-Jan-13, 01:25 PM
I've got a scar on my hand from some lead casting I did as a kid.

I got this "games workshop" make our own lead figures kit.
Pretty cool stuff I made whole armies of orcs etc, then one day I didn't notice that the mold was wet and a steam bubble errupted and I splashed molten lead on my hand.
Hmmm, must have been kind of a "drag". Hope you were able to "cope" with it OK.

I still have many scars from similar experiences, at home and at work; funny how skin has a memory...

Candy
2005-Jan-13, 01:38 PM
I've got a scar on my hand from some lead casting I did as a kid.

I got this "games workshop" make our own lead figures kit.
Pretty cool stuff I made whole armies of orcs etc, then one day I didn't notice that the mold was wet and a steam bubble errupted and I splashed molten lead on my hand.

Ok, don't make fun of me. When I worked at Domino's making pizza's, I would burn my knuckles/hands on the ovens all the time. I finally got the hang of it. I have the scars to prove it. :o

captain swoop
2005-Jan-13, 02:17 PM
When I first left school I was an Apprentice at British Stell redcar, working on the Number One Blast Furnace. It's the biggest in Europe and it Taps over 8000 tonnes of Pig Iron a day. Following that I worked on the 'basic Oxygen' furnaces where it's converted into Steel and I worked on the Pipe Mill for a while as well. On the Basic Oxygen plant our Ladles were big enough to hold a couple of Station Wagons.


Everyone in the area either went to one of the British Steel plants or ICI as either a Process worker or a Technical Apprentice.

Tuckerfan
2005-Jan-14, 12:22 AM
My job is mentally tougher...my boss has a 6th grade education, and is proud of it. My shift manager is better educated, but a bigger idiot.

(yes, last night we did everything bass ackwards)Meet my supervisor, Pete Puma. (http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net//Forum1/HTML/008330.html)
What kind of management structure (if any) does the company have? Or is "Pete" being "family" enough to exempt him from normal rules of conduct? Sounds as though that's the case.Yup. There's a little more to it than that, but not much.


So you make your own castings and then machine them? Must be a lot of short-run specialty type jobs. Not really. The washers we're pouring in the photo have been made by us for about 30 years now. There's some short run jobs, but most of the stuff is yearlong contracts or better.
Sounds potentially frustrating in another way, i.e., if you find a void or features that won't clean up on one of your own castings, whom do you blame? :wink:We blame the welder. ;)


If "Pete"'s a fixture and untouchable, then your plan to move on as soon as things are optimal is a good idea. Otherwise you'll spend months and years banging your head against a wall, and eventually will be made a scapegoat by "Pete". Those sort of persons may appear to be dumb, and in many cases are dumb, but they usually manage to survive off of instincts and cunning. Plus it would be good to working somewhere else when your current employer goes out of business, which appears to be inevitable.Yup.


BTW, one of the posters on the linked thread mentioned using your ideas and creations as a negotiating chip if you are seeking a raise or perhaps a promotion. He said these things were your "intellectual property". It would be good to check all the paperwork you signed when taking the job to see if there is a standard intellectual property release in there somewhere. This is a "boilerplate", but very legally binding, form that says, in short, that anything you invent and any other ideas you implement in the course of your employment, belong to the company.

Use of this form is standard practice in almost all companies. But, who knows, in a company as poorly managed as where you currently work, HR (or whoever fills that role) may have forgotten about it or may not even be aware of such a thing.Actually, the documents I signed were so poorly worded that there's no way they could stand up in court. :D


One question: are your products finished components? Or are they shipped to your customer for additional/final machining, etc. If the latter, then that might explain how "Pete"'s been getting away with creating crap for all these years. If the former, then that might explain why the company is on the verge of bankruptcy.It depends upon the part. Some of them are fully finished, and others are simply cleaned up.


Good luck!Thanks.


PS: if someone attempted to transfer those "blue-ears" into my inspection department, they'd find, in short order, that their ears would be even bluer, being out in the cold outdoors, looking in.Ditto. I don't understand why folks are so reluctant to fire people who are obviously incompetent.

Tuckerfan
2005-Jan-14, 12:29 AM
It's not 8 cups a day, it's 16 cups a heat, 8 heats a day. Each ladle holds about 50 lbs of molten steel. The furnace, that Big John's poking with a stick (actually a piece of rebar) holds 800 lbs of steel at a time. As for what I do when I'm not pouring steel, I work in the machine shop

OK I get it. That "metal pouring" job has some secrets to me. At least I know now what your job consists of (and it doesn't sound like waiting all day :)). Now my second question is WHY. Why are you standing there with two men pouring metal. Can't this very easily be done automatically? (I don't want you to lose your job :) ).

Or is it that you constantly have to watch the stream of metal to see if everything looks correct, so automatisation would be very hard? So I'm not asking why you are pouring steel, but why you are doing it by hand.In a small place like ours, it's not really cost effective to do a lot of automation like that. The environment is exceedingly harsh, so everything has to be rugged in order to survive it. Plus, we heat using an induction furnace, so anything electronic has to be hardened otherwise it gets scrambled by the EMF. Additionally, the manual set up allows a lot of flexibility in what we pour. We can pour small parts like in the photo, or we can pour very large impellers for ships, and an automated set up would make it more difficult to do. Finally, some alloys have to be slowly poured into the trees (bronze is like a thick syrup), while other alloys need to be dumped into the trees as fast as possible in order to reduce the number of voids in the final castings.

dgruss23
2005-Jan-14, 01:29 AM
Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me?
I don't have pictures, but yesterday my spouse spent most of his day with his arm up a cow's back end (pregnancy checks) and then got kicked trying to replace a cow's uterus that had been ejected during calving.
He has a lovely 8" diameter bruise to prove it.

I have a good friend that does that as a side job. It leads to some good humor. Yep - he's been kicked too.

dgruss23
2005-Jan-14, 01:32 AM
That's me on the left, holding the other end of the shank. (http://www.pctcast.net/CRW_0009.jpg) In case you're wondering, that's molten steel at around 3000F in the ladle. I some times do that eight or more times a day. Anybody wanna say they've got a tougher job than me? ;)

Hot metal - looks "cool", but I suppose that wears off quickly!

Hey, you could always go work for Saruman! At least that's what the picture reminded me of. :)

captain swoop
2005-Jan-14, 10:29 AM
[quote="Tuckerfan Plus, we heat using an induction furnace, so anything electronic has to be hardened otherwise it gets scrambled by the EMF. quote]

A few years ago I was working on a contract to upgrade a network for an engineering company in Stoke on Trent. They manufacture one way butterfly valves for the Petro Chemical industry, they range in size from 15mm up to 155m in diameter.

Anyway the main parts are cast. They have an Induction furnace and the network cables that had been used for that part of the building were unsheilded. Every time it turned on that part of the network fell over.

In addition to velves they also owned a company that manufactured materials for the dental and jewelry industry. Specialist waxes and plasters for investment casting.

Fram
2005-Jan-14, 12:02 PM
[quote="Tuckerfan Plus, we heat using an induction furnace, so anything electronic has to be hardened otherwise it gets scrambled by the EMF. quote]

A few years ago I was working on a contract to upgrade a network for an engineering company in Stoke on Trent. They manufacture one way butterfly valves for the Petro Chemical industry, they range in size from 15mm up to 155m in diameter.

Anyway the main parts are cast. They have an Induction furnace and the network cables that had been used for that part of the building were unsheilded. Every time it turned on that part of the network fell over.

In addition to velves they also owned a company that manufactured materials for the dental and jewelry industry. Specialist waxes and plasters for investment casting.

I normally don't pick on typo's, I make enough of them myself, but I just wanted to check. They are not really making butterfly valves with a diameter of 155 meter, do they? :o

Captain Kidd
2005-Jan-14, 12:53 PM
I've seen a butterfly valve big enough to park a full sized pickup on the disc and an 18 foot inside diameter ball valve. But 155m, wow. So, I'm guessing this is something FedEx probably wouldn't ship.

Speacking of tough jobs, I got the chance to volunteer to do some Steam Generator jumping. You dress out in full protective gear including SCBA air supply, wiggle through an access port into a high radiation area to turn a nut five or six times and then wiggle back out. Congratulations, in ten minutes you've maxed your dose allowance, go sit on the bench for the rest of the outage. Oh, and don't get too many x-rays done this year.

Yeah, that's why I work in the office folks. 8-[

Maksutov
2005-Jan-14, 01:28 PM
I've seen a butterfly valve big enough to park a full sized pickup on the disc and an 18 foot inside diameter ball valve. But 155m, wow. So, I'm guessing this is something FedEx probably wouldn't ship.

Speacking of tough jobs, I got the chance to volunteer to do some Steam Generator jumping. You dress out in full protective gear including SCBA air supply, wiggle through an access port into a high radiation area to turn a nut five or six times and then wiggle back out. Congratulations, in ten minutes you've maxed your dose allowance, go sit on the bench for the rest of the outage. Oh, and don't get too many x-rays done this year.

Yeah, that's why I work in the office folks. 8-[
Is REM one of your favorites bands?

captain swoop
2005-Jan-14, 01:28 PM
Yup, was a typo, should have been 1.5m

Moose
2005-Jan-14, 01:49 PM
Yeah, that's why I work in the office folks. 8-[

Yeah, but on the plus side, you can be your own reading lamp. :P

captain swoop
2005-Jan-14, 02:21 PM
here (http://www.goodwin.co.uk/gsc/valves_general.htm) are the castings, the company is called Goodwins, they can cast up to 9000Kg