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View Full Version : Do butterflies remember caterpillarhood?



Tom Mazanec
2017-Oct-25, 07:49 PM
Perhaps caterpillars could have a simple trained behavior and see if it carries across metamorphosis?

NorthernDevo
2017-Oct-25, 07:58 PM
Perhaps caterpillars could have a simple trained behavior and see if it carries across metamorphosis?

:surprised:

How do you train a caterpillar? "Shake a paw! .er...claw! Heere boy!" :think:

A rolled-up newspaper would NOT be a good idea...for obvious reasons.

:D

DonM435
2017-Oct-25, 08:39 PM
Not too long ago, I saw a Cary Grant film that involved a dancing caterpillar. Seriously.

Once Upon a Time (1944)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0037150/

grant hutchison
2017-Oct-25, 08:46 PM
Do butterflies remember caterpillarhood?
Yes (http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0001736).

Grant Hutchison

WaxRubiks
2017-Oct-25, 09:04 PM
Do they carry over the same brain from caterpillar stage to moth stage? Or do they grow a new one?

grant hutchison
2017-Oct-25, 09:35 PM
Do they carry over the same brain from caterpillar stage to moth stage? Or do they grow a new one?Bit of both.

Grant Hutchison

Tom Mazanec
2017-Oct-25, 11:38 PM
Published: March 5, 2008

Hey, that was my birthday. Big Five-oh.

Trebuchet
2017-Oct-26, 12:02 AM
Perhaps caterpillars could have a simple trained behavior and see if it carries across metamorphosis?

Of course not, don't be ridiculous!


Yes (http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0001736).

Grant Hutchison

Oh. Mind blown.

I'm not sure I'd really call that "memory" in the sense it's usually used, however.

WaxRubiks
2017-Oct-26, 12:19 AM
Oh. Mind blown.

I'm not sure I'd really call that "memory" in the sense it's usually used, however.

perhaps you could teach caterpillars the Inchworm song, and try to get the moths/butterflies to sing it....could be a Christmas number one!

:)

PetersCreek
2017-Oct-26, 01:18 AM
A disappointing number of posts are off topic. This is not a joke thread, folks.

Grey
2017-Oct-26, 04:08 PM
My family has raised monarch butterflies from caterpillars every summer since I was young (it's a tradition I've carried on with my own children). One of the intriguing things is that butterflies raised this way are tame when they come out of the chrysalis. They'll cheerfully sit on your hand or shoulder or head, they'll drink sugar water from your finger, and they don't seem to show any particular skittishness around humans. We release them, and in some years we've tagged them, so we know that they head south along with the rest of the population for winter. But it's certainly always seemed as though something carried over. As grant notes, from studies done, it does seem that at least some of the nervous system gets carried over from caterpillar to butterfly, rather than being completely rebuilt from scratch, although some portions of it are. Metamorphosis is weird.

slang
2017-Oct-26, 09:11 PM
Yes (http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0001736).

Wow... they even checked if the electrical shocks didn't affect the sensors themselves, rather than memory. To the layman that appears to be a very, very careful study. I wish those popping up with ATM proposals would once, just once, propose similarly precise defined tests for their idea.

Interesting read, thanks. Now I know what an instar is.

BigDon
2017-Oct-27, 01:20 PM
One interesting bit is if you implant electronics into a caterpillar just before it goes into its chrysalis stage the butterfly's internal organs conform around the implants.

They were too vulnerable to predators to be worth the expenditures. It turns out that as soon as a butterfly stops acting like a butterfly it draws unwanted attention from the local predators. This is an ongoing problem for insect/spyware hybrids using other insects as well.

Things act the way they do in the wild because they have to...