View Full Version : Discussion: Perfect Liquid Hints at Early ...

2005-Apr-20, 04:46 PM
SUMMARY: Physicists with MIT have reported the discovery of a new state of matter - a perfect liquid - which was probably present in the earliest moments after the Big Bang. The team smashed atoms together in the Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider, creating a plasma that lasted for only an instant. The particles in the plasma have the same properties as a liquid; they cling together and move in a pattern, but they would flow much more easily than water if they could be poured.

View full article (http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish/early_universe_liquid.html)

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2005-Apr-21, 04:54 PM
This appears to fit more closely to the string theorists' model of an early universe with lower entropy. Whether it fits that model completely remains to be seen.

Yet, it depends upon how you look at it..Since all of the matter seems to flow more easily we could define this as higher entropy, with more degrees of freedom realized..On the other hand, the constituents behaving like a school of fish implies less entropy...Nice puzzle..

2005-Apr-21, 09:22 PM
MY! My! how clever are these folks to conclude so much using such a small amount of data collected over such a short interval of time and using a brief analytical period. I wonder how one separates artificial (human caused) transients and their associated products from otherwise naturally occurring events and objects. Can we be forcing configurations of mass/energy that would not otherwise occur thereby creating primrose paths that we would do well to avoid? How shall we identify the more productive paths among them?

2005-Apr-22, 03:07 AM

They did't do just one experiment.

You misread the article which could have been written a touch better. The author of that article assumed all readers understood what the term "discovery" means to a quantum physicist.

When a particle physicist does one billion billion experiments and comes up with predicted results 35% of the time, no announcement of any kind can be made to the public...When desired results are successful 68% of the time they can claim they have a "finding", but no discovery. When a billion billion experiments produce desired results 99.999% of the time, they can announce that a "discovery" has been made..They cannot use the term "discovery" unless those conditions have been met...

There are billions of collisions taking place each second at colliders and computers that receive the results from detectors constantly..Most particle physicists work 7 day weeks. I know several of them at Fermilab and Argonne..If they make just one mathematical mistake they are fired.

2005-Apr-22, 01:10 PM
You are correct about my understanding of "discovery". If the criteria you describe are correct, I'm astonished that Fermi laboratory can maintain a working crew with members of much longevity. Their conclusion still seems to have been hastily reached. It is beyond my comprehension that they ever got enough stuff to exist over an appreciable time interval to guess at how 10^23 or so individuals would behave as a group at pressures anywhere near those present in the first few hours of the BB.

2005-Apr-22, 06:41 PM
You might want more detail of the 3 years of data. Go here (http://www.bnl.gov/bnlweb/pubaf/pr/RHIC-peer.asp) and click on the PHENIX and the STAR collaboration links for over 200 pages of pdf files containing the information that you might be looking for..

The PHOBOS and the BRAHMS perspectives both will cost you money and I wasn't up to paying..

Mr. Smartypants gamer guy
2005-Apr-27, 12:58 PM
this reminds me of the black hole thing a wile back about black holes containing the "perfect" liquid... maybe there like, o idont know, closly related in some way???