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Rodina
2003-Jan-29, 09:53 PM
This might be old news, but it was the first I heard of slightly more concrete plans for a return to Jupiter.

http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewnews.html?id=714

Glom
2003-Jan-29, 10:22 PM
I hope that put a Europa lander on it like Huygens on Cassini.

calliarcale
2003-Jan-29, 10:44 PM
Dangit, somebody already posted it here. /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif I just heard about this, and the first thing I did was cuss a blue stream because I'm so overwhelmingly happy. Call me a Jupiter-obsessed space geek, but this is the best news I've heard all year! (Okay, the proposed $1.2 billion for fuel cell automobile research from Dubya was pretty cool. But Jupiter!!! AWESOME!!!!)

Rodina
2003-Jan-29, 10:54 PM
Well, they are obviously talk about a whole big bunch of delta-V, to pop in and out of orbit around various Jovian satellites, so maybe it won't be impossible to hope for a Europa Lander as well. Europa Lander/Jovian Observer (ELJO, that's a good-sounding NASA acronym)

Thumper
2003-Jan-30, 12:38 PM
On 2003-01-29 17:54, Rodina wrote:

Europa Lander/Jovian Observer (ELJO, that's a good-sounding NASA acronym)


Reverse it and you could call him "JOEL".

kucharek
2003-Jan-30, 01:13 PM
I also hope that this project materializes. Having a probe propulsion system with plenty of delta-vee opens up many exciting possibilities.
Maybe the use Europa as a tank-stop /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif, but when I look at the current trouble the US government has with Europe, maybe they leave it out completely /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_frown.gif.
I guess, due to high radiation, orbiting Io is out of the question.

Harald


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: kucharek on 2003-01-30 08:14 ]</font>

tusenfem
2003-Jan-30, 02:26 PM
Well, that is good news, if it goes through. I must admid I enjoyed the years that I worked on the Galileo project. Now I don't have that much time for it anymore, but still try to do something. I would love to join in on this project, I will keep my eyes open for openings /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Martin

David Hall
2003-Jan-30, 02:56 PM
While this is great, and it sounds like a really cool mission, I just want to know why this thing so easily got $3 billion but a simple Pluto flyby has been struggling with funding for years. C'mon, let's at least get a look at all the planets before we go focusing on one or two!

This Is Your Brain On FOX
2003-Jan-30, 06:47 PM
This is good news, I heard the planned Jupiter moon mission was canceled in September

tusenfem
2003-Jan-31, 09:33 AM
On 2003-01-30 09:56, David Hall wrote:
While this is great, and it sounds like a really cool mission, I just want to know why this thing so easily got $3 billion but a simple Pluto flyby has been struggling with funding for years. C'mon, let's at least get a look at all the planets before we go focusing on one or two!



Well, I guess one of the main problems with pluto express is that it goes there at an enormous speed, and takes one little snapshot of the planet and its moon and moves on chasing voyager. It would be good to go there, but I think that this is one of the main obstacles.
Martin

WHarris
2003-Jan-31, 12:39 PM
On 2003-01-30 13:47, This Is Your Brain On FOX wrote:
This is good news, I heard the planned Jupiter moon mission was canceled in September


That was the Europa lander mission. This one would be an orbiter type mission.

CJSF
2003-Jan-31, 01:24 PM
I think it's partially a cover for military applications. Tag science onto a mission that scientists and much of the general public just can't refuse, which happens to have a nuclear propulsion system. Test that baby far from Earth, gather your data and then slap it on the next generation of military satellites and such.

IMHO, of course

CJSF

kucharek
2003-Jan-31, 01:32 PM
And of what use would be a nuclear propulsion system to a military satellite?

CJSF
2003-Jan-31, 02:34 PM
On 2003-01-31 08:32, kucharek wrote:
And of what use would be a nuclear propulsion system to a military satellite?


Space based weaponry ("Star Wars" program) will likely be fission based. Prove that a fission system can be used safely for an extened period of time, and soon after it'll be in Earth orbit, powering missle defense systems and such. And who knows, maybe a high delta-vee satellite would become useful - quickly moving among different orbits for various missions.

I think weight savings for very large satellites would be the biggest advantage, though. See this site (http://www.astrodigital.org/space/nuclear.html).

I'm not against nuclear powered spacecraft. I just question the motives behind another Jupiter mission, when missions to Pluto have been cancelled, and we haven't done any follow-ups to Uranus or Neptune, or even Mercury for that matter. I think the Jovian system provides a great cover for a nuclear testbed.

CJSF

Again, IMHO.



CJSF



_________________
"Be very, very careful what you put into that head, because you will never,
ever get it out."
-Thomas Cardinal Wolsey (1471-1530)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Christopher Ferro on 2003-01-31 09:53 ]</font>

nebularain
2003-Jan-31, 04:23 PM
The re-kindled interest in Jupiter began when water was discovered on Europa, and so many people have been crying out about searching the moon for possible life that it makes more political sense to "follow the noise" so to speak.

Although more missions to the less understood outer planets would be cool, we can't complain that space exploration is still being given some boost!

CJSF
2003-Jan-31, 04:38 PM
I agree, but then keep the Europa orbiter on track. This is not going to be a Europa mission but a Jovian mission.

Oh well

CJSF

irony
2003-Jan-31, 07:07 PM
The thing about Pluto is that it wanders out very far away from the sun, so there's only a tiny window when we can launch something that will get there (a) while the planet still has an atmosphere (the atmosphere condenses out when it gets too far from the Sun), and (b) before the people who designed the thing retire. Jupiter will always be only a few years away. Pluto we have to wait two hundred years for it to come around again.

daver
2003-Jan-31, 07:49 PM
On 2003-01-31 09:34, Christopher Ferro wrote:


On 2003-01-31 08:32, kucharek wrote:
And of what use would be a nuclear propulsion system to a military satellite?


Space based weaponry ("Star Wars" program) will likely be fission based. Prove that a fission system can be used safely for an extened period of time, and soon after it'll be in Earth orbit, powering missle defense systems and such.


Already been done--the fission reactor part, anyway.



And who knows, maybe a high delta-vee satellite would become useful - quickly moving among different orbits for various missions.



Yep, it could. Space tug comes to mind. That's for a moderately high thrust high delta v engine. For a jupiter mission, the delta v is more important than the thrust; it's not clear that there would be that many near-earth military applications for anything derived from a Jupiter mission.

So far i haven't seen anything but speculation on the Prometheus project.

Colt
2003-Jan-31, 08:43 PM
I doubt that a sytem of this type would be small enough to feasibly put on a missile, like the ones you would use for SDI. Maybe a guided missile cruiser (CG) that would use this technology to carry small swarms of normal missiles. Not to derail this thread into something military though..

I think that his technology could best be used for non-military, peaceful, purposes. Like the above-mentioned Orbital Tug (Otter?). That might come in handy for the ISS instead of having the Orbiter and astronauts man-handle everything into place. There is a drawing I have somewhere of a fairly simple tug/ferry thing.. I will find it when I get home. -Colt