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Captain Kidd
2003-Feb-21, 08:48 PM
Hi, as you can see by my post count I'm kinda new to the boards here so treat me gently. /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_smile.gif Naw, rip away if I step out of line. /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Here's my question. A while ago, oh how I wish I could remember when and where, I heard/read (I can't remember which) that one of our probes (again I'm beating my head into my desk trying to remember which one) was not where it was suppose to be. It's out past Pluto but not as far out as it should be.
Well I just Googled for fifteen minutes and can't find a thing.
Has anybody else heard about this or am I going nuts?

RafaelAustin
2003-Feb-21, 09:01 PM
Welcome to the Board!

I believe that's a reference to either Voyager or Pioneer data that seemed (with some imaginative work) to indicate that a large object in the Kuiper's Belt or Oort Cloud area was exerting a previously unknown gravitational force on the probes. The Planet X camp (and others) I think have been trying to use this as proof.

You might skim through the Planet X or Against the mainstream forums to see if anything rings a bell.

P.S. I think most people here will disagree with those findings or at least the PX assertions.

[EDIT] I found these pages on the BABB:

Anomalous Acceleration of Pioneer 10 and 11 (http://www.badastronomy.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=469&forum=1)

Pioneer retardation solved? (http://www.badastronomy.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=1020&forum=1)

Wal Thornhill on Pioneer 10's retardation (http://www.badastronomy.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=1461&forum=1)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: rafaelaustin on 2003-02-21 16:11 ]</font>

Captain Kidd
2003-Feb-22, 02:34 AM
Ah ha, thanks!

The Shade
2003-Feb-22, 02:36 AM
Actually, I remember reading somewhere that on of the Pioneers were ever so slightly off their expected course and that a search was on for the unknown Kuiper Belt Object that had thrown it off its expected course. I haven't heard anything new since then. /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_frown.gif

The Shade
2003-Feb-22, 02:37 AM
Oh, and welcome to the board. You will find that almost everyone here, excepting the occasional troll, are very nice people who will treat you with the respect you deserve. Gawd, I love this place. /phpBB/images/smiles/icon_wink.gif

roidspop
2003-Feb-22, 03:04 AM
There has been an even more interesting interpretation of the tiny little discrepancies in the orbits of these probes and what conventional gravitational theory says we should see.

As I understand it, the theory involves very small alterations in the basic relationship between gravitational and inertial mass at extremely small accelerations. I think the theory is referred to as MOND. I've seen claims that it eliminates the need for dark matter to account for the 'missing mass' in the Universe.

http://www.astro.umd.edu/~ssm/mond/

[fixed sp & added link]

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: roidspop on 2003-02-22 00:44 ]</font>

Mellow
2003-May-08, 07:54 PM
Hello, very very new to the board...

Does the retardation explain why Voyager (1 or 2) rather than Pioneer 10 is the most distant man made object? I always wondered when Voiyager overtook Pioneer.

Ta

kurtisw
2003-May-09, 01:52 PM
Hello, very very new to the board...

Does the retardation explain why Voyager (1 or 2) rather than Pioneer 10 is the most distant man made object? I always wondered when Voiyager overtook Pioneer.


No, Voyager is just moving faster than Pioneer. Voyager 1 was aimed very close to Jupiter to get up-close pictures of Io and other unique science, so it picked up extra velocity. In fact, Voyager 1's velocity after the event meant that it got to Saturn too early to be able to reach Uranus and Neptune, which is why Voyager 2 went on alone.

ToSeek
2003-May-09, 04:36 PM
Hello, very very new to the board...

Does the retardation explain why Voyager (1 or 2) rather than Pioneer 10 is the most distant man made object? I always wondered when Voyager overtook Pioneer.

Ta

No, the retardation is very, very tiny. We're talking about a deceleration force on the order of one ten-billionth of Earth's gravity. The effect could be replicated by sticking a lighted 60-watt light bulb on the outbound side of Pioneer because the outgoing photons would tend to slow the spacecraft down.

Mellow
2003-Jun-04, 01:39 PM
Thanks for your responses, I really appreciated them. I'm not a scientist but educated to degree level in Computing. I've had a few questions That have been bouncing around my head for years, since I was a child staring up at the night sky.

Thanks again