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Denis12
2006-Oct-06, 08:51 PM
Why is it that there is no news and pictures of the Arrived (some months ago) Venus express? Can somebody here explain that?

Thanks.

01101001
2006-Oct-06, 09:10 PM
Why is it that there is no news and pictures of the Arrived (some months ago) Venus express? Can somebody here explain that?

It arrived; there was news. See Venus Express Multimedia Gallery (http://www.esa.int/esa-mmg/mmg.pl?mission=Venus+Express&type=I)

As is usual, the scientists who already put in much effort on the project will be partially repaid by getting exclusive access to the data for a period, while they do their research and write their papers. After some period, agreed upon in advance, then the data will be released to the archives for public access, by people who weren't part of the teams that made it happen.

You are probably used to the raw images provided in near real-time from the likes of the MER and Cassini-Huygens missions. Those scientists chose to open their kimonos early and show some (even they don't show all) of what they had. Other teams choose to operate in other ways. It's their choice. I wish they would show more, but they choose not to.

Watch ESA Venus Express pages (http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Venus_Express/index.html) for news.

Blob
2006-Oct-13, 06:18 PM
In its relentless probing of Venus's atmosphere, ESA's Venus Express keeps revealing new details of the Venusian cloud system. Meteorology at Venus is a complex matter, scientists say.
New night-side infrared images gathered by the Ultraviolet, Visible and Near-Infrared Mapping Spectrometer (VIRTIS) in July 2006, clearly show new details of a complex cloud system.

image (http://esamultimedia.esa.int/images/venusexpress/Orbit_93_night_17_full_H.jpg) (352kb, 2300 x 700)

The first (false colour) view - the composite of three infrared images acquired by VIRTIS, was taken on 22 July when the spacecraft was flying around the apocentre of its orbit (point of maximum distance from the planet surface) at about 65 000 kilometres altitude. Venus was in the night side.

See more (http://www.esa.int/SPECIALS/Venus_Express/SEM65OV74TE_1.html)

01101001
2007-Nov-01, 05:46 PM
Planetary Society Weblog: ESA mission updates: Rosetta and Venus Express (http://planetary.org/blog/article/00001214/)


As for Venus Express, the latest update on that mission contained some news [...]. Apparently the first science results from the mission are FINALLY going to see the light of day in a special issue of Nature currently scheduled for publication on November 29, 2007 [...]. It's my understanding that this long-delayed publication is one of the main obstacles preventing more Venus Express images and results from being communicated to the public. I fervently hope that more stuff will get released after those articles get in to print.

astromark
2007-Nov-01, 06:24 PM
What sort of fuzzy logic keeps new information from us... the public. These same scientists want more funding for still more research. The silence is deafning.... I would not pay for this...aparent arrogance.
One could be forgiven for jumping to the wrong conclusions here. Have 'they' found the ruins of cities, and are keeping it mom... No. Not a likely possibility, but if the silence is misleading we can not be blamed.:)

01101001
2007-Nov-01, 06:45 PM
What sort of fuzzy logic keeps new information from us... the public.

It seems to me it's the price ESA willingly negotiates for getting the scientists to work on the projects. If they didn't get temporary exclusive access -- which can advance their careers -- and they were still interested in devoting their time, they'd be wise to ask for much more monetary compensation to participate. To me, it's not fuzzy logic. It's economics -- the fuzzy science.

If you are a resident of a member nation of ESA, ask your government representatives to change the decision-making process in the negotiations to give more weight to immediate public access, if you feel you really need it badly. (But, aren't you in New Zealand? You may not have much influence over ESA.)

There's some inertia to overcome; it's been done the way it's done a long time. Point out the newer models of, for instance, NASA's MER and MRO projects that seem to be working well.

tusenfem
2007-Nov-01, 07:07 PM
The "first results" papers are due early november in Nature, just wait 1 or 2 weeks. The last paper was accepted last week.

One of the problems with publishing in a journal like Nature is that they want exclusive rights to what is published and you cannot use it anymore until it has been published by Nature. This has probably hampered some of the stuff coming out because of one project being very very late with getting the paper finished.

As it is now, I can only talk about the magnetometer team, I/we have many papers ready for publication, some of them are already at various journals (including Nature). The problem with the magnetometer was that the spacecraft is not magnetically clean, i.e. there are a lot of magnetic disturbances from the spacecraft itself, and it takes a lot of effort to clean up the data, however, a comparison with our cleaned data and a chance encounter/flyby of messenger showed that our method is very very good.

So, just a teeny bit of patience and you will get results.

added
Ah, I just saw that the message by 01101001 confirms what I wrote about Nature.

jlhredshift
2007-Nov-01, 07:48 PM
The "first results" papers are due early november in Nature, just wait 1 or 2 weeks. The last paper was accepted last week.

One of the problems with publishing in a journal like Nature is that they want exclusive rights to what is published and you cannot use it anymore until it has been published by Nature. This has probably hampered some of the stuff coming out because of one project being very very late with getting the paper finished.

As it is now, I can only talk about the magnetometer team, I/we have many papers ready for publication, some of them are already at various journals (including Nature). The problem with the magnetometer was that the spacecraft is not magnetically clean, i.e. there are a lot of magnetic disturbances from the spacecraft itself, and it takes a lot of effort to clean up the data, however, a comparison with our cleaned data and a chance encounter/flyby of messenger showed that our method is very very good.

So, just a teeny bit of patience and you will get results.

added
Ah, I just saw that the message by 01101001 confirms what I wrote about Nature.


Hey thats great, as soon as it is published I can download.... no wait... Oh no I'm a non-subscriber

tusenfem
2007-Nov-01, 07:59 PM
Hey thats great, as soon as it is published I can download.... no wait... Oh no I'm a non-subscriber

Ah, well, even in Ohio there must be a library which has the journal.

jlhredshift
2007-Nov-01, 08:05 PM
Ah, well, even in Ohio there must be a library which has the journal.

39 miles

Jason Thompson
2007-Nov-02, 12:32 PM
What sort of fuzzy logic keeps new information from us... the public. These same scientists want more funding for still more research.

The logic is that the scientists who developed the machines want exclusive access to analyse the data for a period in order to prevent 'scooping': that is to say they, quite reasonably, don't want someone else looking at the data they devoted a large portion of their time and effort to obtaining and publishing new discoveries and getting all the credit with none of the legwork. The public do get to see the data, they just have to wait a while for it.

tusenfem
2007-Nov-02, 04:41 PM
39 miles

Well, if you behave yourself maybe I will send you the pdfs when I get them.

Noclevername
2007-Nov-02, 04:46 PM
What sort of fuzzy logic keeps new information from us... the public. These same scientists want more funding for still more research. The silence is deafning.... I would not pay for this...aparent arrogance.

Science is a very competitive business, unfortunately. In order to get funding and/or credit, lots of maneuvering goes on, sometimes leading to a bit of professional paranoia and sometimes even dirty tricks, such as "claim-jumping".