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g99
2003-Jun-18, 02:03 AM
UFO Magazine (Vol 23 No.4 a) Has two articles quoting James Oberg.

One is about the shuttle investigation. The other is About Apollo and Dave Percy. The article talks about the Surveyor 3 footage and the irregularities Percy find in it.

The article states that the footage Percy uses is not a NASA footage and not JPL either. James Oberg was cited as staing that information.

Surprisingly Cosmic dave is cited as asking for proof of the reliability of the footage by Percy. (Is this hoaxist vs. hoaxist?) Percy then writes in a e-mail to the mag. that since NASA and JPL both deny existance of the video and it appears in a film entitled Conquest, it must be from NASA.


Also the ending conclusion by the author of the article states this:
Altough a staunch NASA supporter, James Oberg has also been highly critical of the space agency for its past failings. By flatly denying all knoledge of the Surveyor-3 fly-by footage, and with JPL officials refusing to comment, Oberg's relationship with NASA could be sorely tested if they fail to provide him with definitive andswers to specific issues raised by the apollo conspiracy theorists. .


Other articles state the hoaxed Kubric movie (they actually say it is a hox), an Nazi/Alien base in Antartica, and a picture of James Oberg with the caption :"This is very unusual. I am told this is not typical of a re-entry tile," said retired Admiral Harold Gehman... (they correctly caption Oberg earlier in the mag.


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I do have to say, these conspiracy people are very paranoid. The Antartica article says it all.

JimO
2003-Jun-19, 01:19 PM
UFO Mag's staff is very skilled at pandering to their target audience's foibles, but I have concluded they aren't as big a lump of idiots as they appear -- they are making a living off of other people's idiocies.

Graham2001
2003-Jun-19, 01:42 PM
I've noticed the same things about local (Australian) conspiracy publications such as 'New Dawn', for example, when the 'X-Files' came out one of the first letters that appeared in their publication was one which claimed that the series was:

...dramatized accounts of real, but suppressed events... :-?

the editors comments which followed made it quite clear that they didn't think much of this idea, but it didn't stop them from exploiting the concepts that the series presented or from renaming their 'alternative/supressed news' section, "The Real X-Files". :evil:

captain swoop
2003-Jun-19, 02:41 PM
Rememeber the main purpose of any commercial publication is to sell advertising.

I work in the publishing industry supporting editorial and studio systems (Mainly Macs)

I worked for EMAP through most of the 90s. Our part of the Empire was Eland and Metro, these are the 'sexy' and fashionable titles; Elle, New Woman, FHM, Q, Mojo, Heat etc.

It was at the heart of the company that the editorial delivers the advertising.

SeanF
2003-Jun-19, 03:01 PM
Rememeber the main purpose of any commercial publication is to sell advertising.

I work in the publishing industry supporting editorial and studio systems (Mainly Macs)

I worked for EMAP through most of the 90s. Our part of the Empire was Eland and Metro, these are the 'sexy' and fashionable titles; Elle, New Woman, FHM, Q, Mojo, Heat etc.

It was at the heart of the company that the editorial delivers the advertising.

I find this very disconcerting. A publication has to sell advertising in order to survive, and they will do what's necessary (up to a point) to sell that advertising, but saying it's the "main purpose" of any publication scares me.

I have to eat in order to survive, but getting food is not my main purpose. Working (in order to earn the money to buy the food) isn't even my main purpose.

Donnie B.
2003-Jun-19, 03:18 PM
I think he meant it in the same sense as the statement, "The main purpose of a public corporation is to make money for its shareholders." While perfectly true, it leaves out a lot of the story. For example, any corporation must also produce something of value for its customers, comply with all applicable laws and regulations, unshackle its employees from their machines for a few hours in the evening, and so forth.

captain swoop
2003-Jun-19, 04:03 PM
I think he meant it in the same sense as the statement, "The main purpose of a public corporation is to make money for its shareholders." While perfectly true, it leaves out a lot of the story. For example, any corporation must also produce something of value for its customers, comply with all applicable laws and regulations, unshackle its employees from their machines for a few hours in the evening, and so forth.

No, I mean as far as management are concerned the titles were there as vehicles for the advertising.

at the bottom line a publishing company relies entirely on advertising for it's profits. Cover price doesn't even start to cover printing costs. A magazine like FHM has about 30 editorial staff, a smaller title like Smash Hits has about a dozen. Their adveritising teams and their support outnumber them by about 2 to 1.

You should see the pressure and targets the ads sales staff are under to sell that ad space.

For example an inner front cover for one issue of FHM is hundreds of thousands of . Ad teams are selling 6 month and 12 month slots to their main advertising customer.

When push comes to shove if a magazine circulation drops for just one month then the Editor is out, no question, I have seen Eds change 2 or 3 times in a year.

Management and Shareholders don't care what fills the spaces between the ads.


titles within Emap metro would try to steal stories off each other, you get several titles like Mojo, Q, Mixmag and borader entertainment mags like Heat, FHM or Empire and they are all chasing hte same stars and stories.

I have seen Editorial teams from different mags in the same building almost coming to blows, esp the ones in open plan affice space.

Think about it next time you are reading a glossy.

ToSeek
2003-Jun-19, 04:07 PM
Rememeber the main purpose of any commercial publication is to sell advertising.

I work in the publishing industry supporting editorial and studio systems (Mainly Macs)

I worked for EMAP through most of the 90s. Our part of the Empire was Eland and Metro, these are the 'sexy' and fashionable titles; Elle, New Woman, FHM, Q, Mojo, Heat etc.

It was at the heart of the company that the editorial delivers the advertising.

I find this very disconcerting. A publication has to sell advertising in order to survive, and they will do what's necessary (up to a point) to sell that advertising, but saying it's the "main purpose" of any publication scares me.


Well, keep in mind that the primary purpose of a television program is to keep you watching between the ads. ;)

g99
2003-Jun-19, 07:41 PM
I have looked at some of the worse magazines and i agree with you.

I think Cosmo and Maxim are some of the worst . The ad content to actual articles/pictures is at least a 3 to 1 ratio. If there is a 1 page article the next 2 pages is usually an ad, if not more.

Some magazines i feel are relatively good, or better. Popular science actuazlly saves space for articles and MAD Mag. has relatively few adds.

I have noticed that Ad makeres are becoing very sneaky by actually making the text and "look" of thge add to match the magazines style. That way you think it is the magazine actually endorsing them. The only way to tell is to see "special advertising segment" in small letters at the top of the page.


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But to bring theis back to the op:

JimO: Did they interview you for the magazine, or was it just taken from interviews on t.v.?

JimO
2003-Jun-20, 12:18 AM
[quote="captain swoop"]Rememeber the main purpose of any commercial publication is to sell advertising.


This is almost "Oberg's Law of Advertising Heaven" -- they will prefer to spend their money where they have access to the most credulous and judgment-deficient audience. Where better than a UFO magazine or 'docudrama'?

JimO
2003-Jun-20, 12:19 AM
I did not interview for that article, although I've been in email contact on other issues.

Sever
2003-Jun-20, 06:46 PM
But UFO did debunk David Icke plus they have a really neat UFO dvd thing i am trying to get

BCstargazerr
2003-Jun-22, 02:17 AM
i wonder if them magazines cover flying saucers as well cause as "someone" once said "All Flying Saucers Are UFO's but not all UFO's Are Flying Saucers"

RicD
2004-Mar-09, 04:51 PM
I felt free until Icke came along and told me I was 'mentally imprisoned'. Thanks a bunch Icke!

It is easy to debunk him considering he links anything and everything together, most of the time leaning towards snakes and then replites in general.

From what exists in this world it is easy to create a story like this, there are so many ancient places, pointing out the sun and snakes is crazy when he ignores a lot of other stuff to fanatically believe in what he believes.

You could say his theory isnt proof and that you can see he is merely elaborating on things so much all the time and selling books from this.

David Icke says our Government panics us deliberately, so we will conform and so on but hold on, David Icke actually panicked me more than anything else ever has, until he came along I felt free, thats my main point. He sells loads of books and good on him with that I say but I can see how some people would take what he says literally and go do something crazy to someone high up in Government, then what, more legislation to protect MP's. If what Icke says is true, these people could have advanced this agenda a lot quicker than they are doing.

It is funny this thread 'Lunar Conspiracies'. Does that mean about the greater cycles and so on? There is apparently a 26,000 year cycle our solar system goes through. Icke and the like say we are heading into a 'photon belt' soon or 'the light' or 'a time of higher consciousness'. Not sure what I think of this but it could easily be an asteroid belt. Religion and ancient places are telling us about this big cycle but why? We never know WHY it is telling us, it could be warning us, it could be to honor what was once a literally 'magical' time on earth due to this extra energy/frequency put out by the central sun on each of its sides.

You can debunk Icke also by saying - if what he says is true and all religions point to this (2012) then hold on, he also says it is all the work of manipulating aliens, so wouldnt it make a lot more sense if these aliens came here and built the pyramids to drain the higher frequencies from earth to bring about a mundane frequency, the right frequency to make humans slaves? Of course there is always the argument "but did we originally evolve here, or did aliens design us so they can rule over us?"

Either way I dont care really, it doesnt change anything.

I like to think of each country and its changing borders as 'another bit of land on earth' because it is all the same earth. With money I see it only as a piece of paper, not valuable at all. If you have been told 2+2=5 all your life you think its the only way.

Money helps certain individuals but it wrecks us as a whole. The individuals will eventually also suffer but hey, I guess they will be on their way back to Orions belt before that even has the chance to happen.

sts60
2004-Mar-10, 01:51 PM
I felt free until Icke came along and told me I as 'mentally imprisoned'. Thanks a bunch Icke!Welcome to the board, RicD! Cheer up - think of who is telling you you're "imprisoned". :roll:


You could say his theory isnt proofIt's not even a theory.


David Icke says our Government panics us deliberately, Well, governments often hope that the population feels insecure in order to rally around the leaders. But that's happened throughout history.

so we will conform and so on but hold on, David Icke actually panicked me more than anything else ever has, until he came along I felt free, thats my main point.You are free - free to apply rational thought to his absurd claims and see them for the delusions they are.


It is funny this thread 'Lunar Conspiracies'. Does that mean about the greater cycles and so on? There is apparently a 26,000 year cycle our solar system goes through. The Earth, like just about any other spinning object, precesses - that is, it's axis of rotation traces out a circle. The Earth's axis takes about 26,000 years to complete one cycle. (One consequence of this is that the "North Star", Polaris, is only the North Star for a while.) An ordinary top will demonstrate this principle, and you don't have to wait several thousand years to see it. :D


Icke and the like say we are heading into a 'photon belt' soon or 'the light' or 'a time of higher consciousness'. No, it's the Hyperdimensional Crystal Ultravibratory Transconscious Convergence. Get it right!

Seriously, Icke's particular fantasy is no different than any other babble from people who like to sling around words like: light, "hyper-" anything, crystal, harmonic, energy, quantum, vibration, cosmic, deeper consciousness, frequency, you name it. All of them are just stuff people make up, and use fancy kinda-scientific-sounding words to sound legitimate. Except Icke's particular hallucination has big lizards.


Not sure what I think of this but it could easily be an asteroid belt. Religion and ancient places are telling us about this big cycle but why? We never know WHY it is telling us, it could be warning us, it could be to honor what was once a literally 'magical' time on earth due to this extra energy/frequency put out by the central sun on each of its sides.The Sun has been pretty stable for billions of years. Otherwise life wouldn't exist on Earth. It's probably good for a few billion more years - plenty of time to make travel plans. :P


You can debunk Icke also by saying - if what he says is true and all religions point to this (2012) then hold on, he also says it is all the work of manipulating aliens, so wouldnt it make a lot more sense if these aliens came here and built the pyramids to drain the higher frequencies from earth to bring about a mundane frequency, the right frequency to make humans slaves? Of course there is always the argument "but did we originally evolve here, or did aliens design us so they can rule over us?"We definitely evolved here, although materials for life may, very arguably, have come from somewhere else. The Pyramids were built by Egyptians. And the Universe is a strange and wonderful place, without any reference needed to the silly mumbo-jumbo of Icke and his "icky" ilk. I'm glad you see through him!

Sigma_Orionis
2004-Mar-10, 03:59 PM
Seriously, Icke's particular fantasy is no different than any other babble from people who like to sling around words like: light, "hyper-" anything, crystal, harmonic, energy, quantum, vibration, cosmic, deeper consciousness, frequency, you name it. All of them are just stuff people make up, and use fancy kinda-scientific-sounding words to sound legitimate. Except Icke's particular hallucination has big lizards.

You forgot 'magnetic' :D