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hush36
2007-Aug-31, 06:36 AM
I've had a thought. Here's my logic :

1) Electromagnetic radiation (in its visible form, light) is a conveyor of energy.
2) Light travels at light speed and therefore is not subject to Time.
3) In the space-time universe, it can be said that a photon "travels" (to stay simple) solely through the spatial dimensions of it.

Ok, here's the question. What if there was another conveyor of energy, similar to electromagnetic radiation, but one that "travels" (again, to stay simple) solely through the Time dimension ? What characteristics would such a conveyor have ?

a) It would have a counterpart photon, that I call a "non-photon".
b) A non-photon would "travel" solely through time
c) Interactions between the photon and the non-photon would be a form of energy that has one "foot" in the spatial dimensions and the other in the Time dimension.
d) A photon/non-photon particle does not run into the space-time "issues" that a normal photon does (meaning that a photon, not being subject to time, can be considered as being in all places in zero time - clearly a problem). This particle of energy would be linked to Time through its non-photon manifestation.

Ok, I might have lost it here but anyway, any thoughts ?

Tog
2007-Aug-31, 07:47 AM
Speaking strictly from a layman's point of view here. My understanding is that the photon exists only in Zero Time from its own point of view. A photon that leaves the Sun, hits Jupiter and passes through my telescope takes about an hour to make the trip, as I perceive time. When I look at Jupiter, I'm looking at where it was 30 minutes ago because light takes time to reach me.

As for the property of the non-photon existing only in time I'm not sure it would even matter what it's properties might be. If there is no spatial component to it, it doesn't seem that it could affect any bit of real matter. If it could it would affect all matter throughout all time which seems like it would have to have a nearly infinite energy capacity, or that the effect is so small it would go completely undetected.

Again, this is purely from a layman's view, so it may be totally off base. See below for any corrections and better explanations.:)

mugaliens
2007-Aug-31, 08:49 AM
I've had a thought. Here's my logic :

1) Electromagnetic radiation (in its visible form, light) is a conveyor of energy.

Technically, it's pure energy that's no longer bound by a mass.


2) Light travels at light speed and therefore is not subject to Time.

True.


3) In the space-time universe, it can be said that a photon "travels" (to stay simple) solely through the spatial dimensions of it.

True, in that the photon experiences no passage of time. The universe continues to age around it during it's passage.


Ok, here's the question. What if there was another conveyor of energy, similar to electromagnetic radiation, but one that "travels" (again, to stay simple) solely through the Time dimension ? What characteristics would such a conveyor have ?

a) It would have a counterpart photon, that I call a "non-photon".
b) A non-photon would "travel" solely through time
c) Interactions between the photon and the non-photon would be a form of energy that has one "foot" in the spatial dimensions and the other in the Time dimension.
d) A photon/non-photon particle does not run into the space-time "issues" that a normal photon does (meaning that a photon, not being subject to time, can be considered as being in all places in zero time - clearly a problem). This particle of energy would be linked to Time through its non-photon manifestation.

Ok, I might have lost it here but anyway, any thoughts ?

Actually, no, I don't think you've lost it. Sounds cool, and is the stuff of Heinlein and Niven. But I like your thinking.

Ok:

Photon - goes the distance without the time.

Non-Photon - goes the time without the distance. (doesn't get out much, does he?)

Without getting into frame-dragging, I'd say, off-hand, that what we're talking about is a graviton, which may be the fundamental nature of space (just space, not time).

Here's some other postulates: Mass warps this graviton framework.

And I think this is new, because to date, all mention of gravitons was that they travelled at the speed of light.

What if, they didn't travel at all, but were locked together in some sort of lattice? Ordinary matter could travel through it with no issues, as can photons, neutrinos, etc., but that the presence of all matter warps the lattice?

You've got me thinking, here, and that's dangerous... :think:

hush36
2007-Aug-31, 09:53 AM
Mugaliens, I was thinking along same lines but... they do travel only in different ways.

The photon part of the particle travels through space, its non-photon counterpart travels though time. Together they form an energy that flows through space-time.

I think I'm trying to say that the photon/non-photon are "two sides of the same coin" and cannot be thought of as "separate" entities.

I look forward to your feedback

mugaliens
2007-Aug-31, 11:49 AM
As your question was about time, I began a thread on what that non-photon might be, here (http://www.bautforum.com/against-mainstream/64105-graviton-matrix-theory-theory-everything.html#post1061871).

Ken G
2007-Aug-31, 08:41 PM
News flash guys: the "non-photon" is you. Or indeed, any observer. As soon as you take the perspective of an observer, you are always moving entirely through time, and you are doing so at the "speed of light". That is because every observation you make is done whereever you are-- same place as you, different time. Your movement is all through time. Indeed, I view time as the fundamental variable that we can measure, distance is more a kind of high-level conceptualization to make sense of what we see.