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PraedSt
2008-Dec-08, 01:30 AM
A month old, but I just spotted it. Sorry if it's been covered before.

Television advertisements can work in fast-forward (http://www.economist.com/business/displaystory.cfm?story_id=12607059)


the rise of digital video recorders (DVRs) such as the TiVo, which record programmes on a hard disk so that they can be watched at any time, also makes it easy to skip past the advertisements. So here, at last, is some good news for advertising folk: it is still possible to get your message across on television, even when a viewer has his finger on the fast-forward button...

when people fast-forward a DVR they actually concentrate intensely on the screen, looking out for the end of the advertising break so that they can get back to their programme. This means they are probably paying more attention than they would if the advertisements were playing normally...

It all depends where the brand image is placed. A viewer who fast-forwards a DVR may see only one in 24 frames. This means some brand images appear on the screen for just a third of a second. But provided the brand image was in the centre of the screen, this was long enough for the volunteers to remember it. Eye-tracking showed viewers concentrated on the centre of the screen while fast-forwarding, probably because it is difficult to keep moving your eyes to take account of things around the edges.You can't win! :)

Similar to, but not the same as, Subliminal Advertising (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subliminal_advertising).

kleindoofy
2008-Dec-08, 01:58 AM
... You can't win! ...
Yes I can.

Advertising actually has an adverse (please excuse the unintentional pun) effect on me. I tend *not* to buy any product I see in an ad, simply because it gives me a feeling of failure, of having been duped by the machine.

This doesn't work all the time since sometimes the product I enjoy is also advertized, but I usually get around the TV products.

In fact, I feel angry when a product that I have been using for years turns up in an ad. I feel soiled and betrayed. ;)

Delvo
2008-Dec-08, 02:25 AM
From the way people talk about using their DVRs, I thought the commercials were completely removed! (I don't have one.) I had no clue that it was really just like with VCRs.

mugaliens
2008-Dec-08, 10:21 AM
I base my purchases on research, quality/cost ratio, min needs, etc., whether it's heavily advertised or not. If they want to waste their money, fine. But if that increased expenditure drivers down the quality/cost ratio such that I go with their competitor, bad on them.

PraedSt
2008-Dec-08, 11:29 AM
I have no objection to the following ads:

1. Ads that make me laugh
2. Ads that inform me of a new product or service
3. Ads in Vogue

All the rest should be outlawed.

tdvance
2008-Dec-08, 03:16 PM
A month old, but I just spotted it. Sorry if it's been covered before.

Television advertisements can work in fast-forward (http://www.economist.com/business/displaystory.cfm?story_id=12607059)

You can't win! :)

Similar to, but not the same as, Subliminal Advertising (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subliminal_advertising).

The way to win (at least, so far)--wait for the DVD of the series to come out!

Someday, they'll figure out this loophole and put commercial breaks on the DVDs (in addition to those at the beginning of so many....).

tdvance
2008-Dec-08, 03:18 PM
From the way people talk about using their DVRs, I thought the commercials were completely removed! (I don't have one.) I had no clue that it was really just like with VCRs.

They used to be. TiVo sued copiers of the technology over the patent and are currently the monopoly on DVRs. TiVo also has contracts with advertisers so they don't eliminate commercials anymore.

Thus--you have to wait till 14 years after the filing of the patent before competition means "no more commercials" (maybe).

Chuck
2008-Dec-08, 03:32 PM
Televisions viewers of the world, unite! We need to form a TV watchers union that will dictate terms to advertisers under threat of boycotting their products.

ravens_cry
2008-Dec-08, 03:46 PM
Ah, but TV viewers aren't the customer, we are the product, sold to advertisers. The television program is just a way of acquiring the product. If they could keep people glued to the set with a black letters on a white background saying 'watch' for thirty seconds, in between 55 minutes and 30 seconds of commercials, they would.
But what do you expect, how can you make any money broadcasting otherwise? You can't make money from the consumers that way. So they make money from the consumers by selling them to people who wish to influence the consumers. It isn't evil, it is business.

Chuck
2008-Dec-08, 03:55 PM
We're both product and customer. We should start behaving more like customer than product.

ravens_cry
2008-Dec-08, 04:40 PM
We're both product and customer. We should start behaving more like customer than product.
In essence we would be cattle rebelling for better feed. But the trouble is, the feed is an expense. That is why the executives loved 'reality' television. A bunch of people, and some cameras and you had a television show, that people watched. The cattle loved it. Or at least enough did that, the ones who didn't, didn't matter.

PraedSt
2008-Dec-08, 04:54 PM
A month old, but I just spotted it. Sorry if it's been covered before.

Television advertisements can work in fast-forward (http://www.economist.com/business/displaystory.cfm?story_id=12607059)
The silver lining? Less incentive for cheesy product placements.

But I hope the spoofs continue...

Wayne's World product placement scene (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XaSLTb7njVE)

:D

SkepticJ
2008-Dec-09, 05:07 PM
Someday, they'll figure out this loophole and put commercial breaks on the DVDs (in addition to those at the beginning of so many....).

The same day I quit buying them, and stick to books and commercial-free videos on the internet (which is where it's all going eventually).

closetgeek
2008-Dec-10, 02:14 PM
SkepticJ have you noticed that you can't even watch a clip on the net without an ad, these days? Sunday night, the kids and I got together to watch Bean on Cartoon network. After a while I began to time how long between the commercials because it seemed to be getting out of hand; 8 minutes of program, 4 minutes of commercials. Really! that is enough.

Fazor
2008-Dec-10, 03:26 PM
8 minutes of program, 4 minutes of commercials. Really! that is enough. We watched some movie on tv the other day that did that. Started out reasonable; but towards the end it was probably a ratio like the one you listed (if not worse). Probably under the assumption that "well now they're hooked and will have to keep watching! EAT ADS, MINDLESS VIEWING PUBLIC! MWAHAHAHA!" (I garuntee the evil laugh was included in at least most of the tv exec's decisions).

NEOWatcher
2008-Dec-10, 03:36 PM
...We watched some movie on tv the other day that did that. Started out reasonable; but towards the end it was probably a ratio like the one you listed (if not worse).
I thought that was the standard nowadays. :think:

I rarely watch live broadcasts. I have found a ratio of about 40 minutes per hour of show, so the above ratio seems about right.*

Also a 110-120 minute movie is usually shown in a 3 hour time slot (if they don't chop the living daylights out of it)

For movies, they seem to start of with 20 minutes commercial free and end up in the 6 to 8 minute range. Commercials start around 3-4 minutes and end up in the 3-6 minute range.

*Estimate based on crude FF through commercials. I'm ashamed to say I still use VHS for recording, but it works great for me because the media is still portable. I also have a 2 speed visual FF/REW.

Fazor
2008-Dec-10, 03:58 PM
Yeah, I flip forward through them (DVR) but this particular movie we were watching live for some reason (perhaps had nothing recorded to watch)

tofu
2008-Dec-10, 04:21 PM
From the way people talk about using their DVRs, I thought the commercials were completely removed! (I don't have one.) I had no clue that it was really just like with VCRs.

Tivo has a 30-second skip forward button, and an 8-second skip backwards button. With these, it is possible to quickly get by most commercials.

You can also transfer your recorded shows to a PC an there's software out there to automatically remove the commercials (http://lifehacker.com/5048824/decrypt-and-remove-commercials-from-tivo-recordings-in-one-step) but that isn't supported by Tivo.

SeanF
2008-Dec-10, 04:33 PM
8 minutes of program, 4 minutes of commercials. Really! that is enough. We watched some movie on tv the other day that did that.
Yeah, about forty-two minutes of actual show in an hour slot is pretty much the standard now.


Started out reasonable; but towards the end it was probably a ratio like the one you listed (if not worse). Probably under the assumption that "well now they're hooked and will have to keep watching! EAT ADS, MINDLESS VIEWING PUBLIC! MWAHAHAHA!" (I garuntee the evil laugh was included in at least most of the tv exec's decisions).
Absolutely, that's why they do it. They bunch up the commercials at the end because people are much less likely to tune out after having already invested an hour and a half and gotten "into" the story.

closetgeek
2008-Dec-10, 04:35 PM
Absolutely, that's why they do it. They bunch up the commercials at the end because people are much less likely to tune out after having already invested an hour and a half and gotten "into" the story.

That's just so underhanded and corporate!

Extravoice
2008-Dec-10, 05:18 PM
To quote Homer Simpson,

"If we don't watch the commercials, we're stealing television!"

:)

Seriously though, someone has to pay for it.

tofu
2008-Dec-10, 05:27 PM
They bunch up the commercials at the end because people are much less likely to tune out after having already invested an hour and a half and gotten "into" the story.

Yes, I simply can't turn away until I know *for sure* that Dr. House will be doing something unrelated to the case and pause mid-sentence in epiphany as he realizes that the person who just bumped into him is wearing a coat - coats have pockets - a pool table has pockets too - that's it! the patient is sick because of bacteria in the swimming pool! That makes perfect sense! You're a genius! *gag*

NEOWatcher
2008-Dec-10, 05:27 PM
That's just so underhanded and corporate!
Actually they are being kind and considerate. The longer you sit and watch the show, the more apt you are to need a break. They're just giving you more time and more flexibility on taking it.

Especially if you started the show with a beer. :lol:

SkepticJ
2008-Dec-10, 06:05 PM
SkepticJ have you noticed that you can't even watch a clip on the net without an ad, these days?

Not really. Ignore the moronic comments that people leave on videos and YouTube's ok.
I do miss Atom Films being commercial-free though; way back in the year 2002, or whenever it was.

NEOWatcher
2008-Dec-10, 06:38 PM
SkepticJ have you noticed that you can't even watch a clip on the net without an ad, these days?
Not really. Ignore the moronic comments that people leave on videos and YouTube's ok.
I do miss Atom Films being commercial-free though; way back in the year 2002, or whenever it was.
It depends on where you go. The worst offenders are getting to be the news outlets.
For text stories, the headline is fairly clear. For the video ones, they come up with some really strangely worded headline to make you say "what?". And then you get a 30 second commercial (which always seems to stream fine). You end up with either a high bandwidth story that never seems to play right, or you end up watching 5 seconds worth to say "blah", this is just a "newsy" commercial anyway.

Let me know what I'm getting into, and I will be happy (well; not exactly) to watch the commercial.

Fazor
2008-Dec-10, 07:06 PM
I hate how more and more stories on CNN.com are "video stories". A) At work I can read an article discreetely and at my leisure; video requires sound (blowing my cover as a slacker) and also continuous spare time to watch.