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dodecahedron
2009-Feb-03, 06:18 PM
Today I decided I'd like to get bagels for breakfast. Just three regular bagels, no sandwiches, no butter, no slicing or toasting.

95 cents for each bagel.

This is more information than I'd like to give on a message board where I can not post anonymously but I really don't get out much and most stuff people take for granted usually surprises and awes me. Last weekend I went to Costco for the first time with friends and could not believe it.

Is 95 cents for a single plain bagel the current average? I thought bagels would be more like 60 cents.

NEOWatcher
2009-Feb-03, 06:44 PM
Today I decided I'd like to get bagels for breakfast. Just three regular bagels, no sandwiches, no butter, no slicing or toasting.
Fresh? Frozen? Packaged? Individual? What about size?

We have fresh bagels at work (company backed cafeteria) for a buck with a single (tiny) butter packet.

BigDon
2009-Feb-03, 07:26 PM
Fresh? Frozen? Packaged? Individual? What about size?

We have fresh bagels at work (company backed cafeteria) for a buck with a single (tiny) butter packet.

Those newish tiny little butter packets, that have more money sunk in the plastic container than in the butter?

Yeah, I want to talk to somebody about those. They violate packaging and consumer laws.

(Sorry)

Dode, The high fuel prices drove a lot of companies out of business, we are still in the resettling phase, and people have to relearn what we will put up with.

NEOWatcher
2009-Feb-03, 07:41 PM
Yeah, I want to talk to somebody about those.
The trick is to use them while they are cold and come out in one piece. Otherwise you'll just leave it all smeared on the edges of the container and end of the knife with nothing left on the bagel.

It's that "healthy for you" portion size. You get more exercise opening all those little packets to get one pat of butter.

dodecahedron
2009-Feb-03, 09:00 PM
Individual single bagels from a bagel shop.

Jeff Root
2009-Feb-04, 06:01 AM
dodecahedron,

Even if you don't get out very often and haven't bought bagels in a bagel
shop in a long time, you still must eat every day. I would expect that you
would pay some attention to prices of foods that you eat, even if someone
else does the shopping for you. Rising food prices were mentioned daily
in the news in the middle of last year, with the price of corn discussed the
most. When the price of one thing goes up it tends to drive up the prices
of other things. Do you grow your own vegetables and raise your own
livestock on feed that you grow yourself? Or how did you manage to
insulate yourself from a general awareness of rising food prices?

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis

BigDon
2009-Feb-04, 07:01 AM
Jesus Jeff, the man is just asking about the price of a bagel!

Jeff Root
2009-Feb-04, 07:50 AM
But Don, it isn't the price of the bagel! It's the cost of fuel for the
ovens, rent for the building, clearing snow from the parking lot,
bonuses for the corporate CEO...

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis

Van Rijn
2009-Feb-04, 07:55 AM
I don't buy bagels often, so I can't answer the question, but I do want to point out that even if you don't eat them, bagels are excellent weapons (http://www.nbc6.net/news/18509984/detail.html).

Ara Pacis
2009-Feb-04, 08:12 AM
Fresh bagels, the big ones, are generally more expensive than a pack of medium-sized premade bagels from the supermegamart for half a dozen for around $2-$3. At some megamarts, like Jewel/Albertson's, I think you can get day-fresh bagels for 2/$1, but that may have changed since I last visited one.

Swift
2009-Feb-04, 02:47 PM
I don't buy bagels often, so I can't answer the question, but I do want to point out that even if you don't eat them, bagels are excellent weapons (http://www.nbc6.net/news/18509984/detail.html).
I don't think they are telling the hole story.

BigDon
2009-Feb-04, 06:30 PM
I still never got an answer I asked in another thread on how, considering all the gyrations one has to go through to make a bagel, how the bakers on my ship would make them by accident while shooting for hamburger buns.

NEOWatcher
2009-Feb-04, 06:31 PM
I still never got an answer I asked in another thread on how, considering all the gyrations one has to go through to make a bagel, how the bakers on my ship would make them by accident while shooting for hamburger buns.
With a slight change in wording... it's easy.

the bakers on my ship would make them by accident while shooting at hamburger buns

Buttercup
2009-Feb-04, 06:39 PM
95 cents per bagel? :confused: What is that store making them out of, gold powder? :(

Around here they average 50 cents/per...if freshly made on-site in the store.

Refrigerated probably average 30 cents/per.

pzkpfw
2009-Feb-04, 07:35 PM
Given the New Zealand (cough) dollar is about 50 US cents right now, and we pay about $1.50 for a plain bagel from the local bagel franchise, that seems OK to me.



(Big Don: a local-ish prune company has recently started selling prunes in plastic bags. Each prune is in that bag - in turn in its' own little wrapper. I'm no "greenie" but that really annoys me.)

BigDon
2009-Feb-04, 07:37 PM
Pzk, and here we have existing laws in place already about over packaging.

NEOWatcher
2009-Feb-04, 08:05 PM
(Big Don: a local-ish prune company has recently started selling prunes in plastic bags. Each prune is in that bag - in turn in its' own little wrapper. I'm no "greenie" but that really annoys me.)
Not just your local-ish. I've seen these (http://www.sunsweet.com/products/info.asp?product=ones) (or something like it) advertised recently.
While on their own "Green Efforts" page it says:


Here are a few of the ways in which we’re moving towards a "green" future:
Reducing the amount of packaging used in Sunsweet products
...

Swift
2009-Feb-04, 08:31 PM
To me, the most important bagel question is not 75 cents versus 95 cents. The question is, is it really a bagel. A lot of what supermarkets sell as "bagels" are not bagels, but what I call "a roll with a hole". Bagels are very different than rolls and other bread.

The dough is different than regular bread dough, and bagels need to be boiled before they are baked. This webpage (http://joepastry.web.aplus.net/index.php?s=bagel) has a lot of details about bagel chemistry, but this is the key part:

I've talked about the why's of bagel boiling, but didn't address all the additives that can, and often do, go into the boiling pot. Everything from sugar to malt syrup to baking soda to lye are used as additives, all of which have the effect of creating a darker, crispier crust. Why darker? Because sugars that are deposited on the outside of a bagel as it boils caramelize in the oven, turning the crust nut-brown (the moisture also helps in this regard, since it encourages the action of enzymes). Alkalines like baking soda or lye have the effect of making the crust both brown and crispy, in the first case because they help break starches down to sugars, and in the second because they react with oven CO2 to create a rigid, edible carbonate, the same thing that gives pretzels their crunch.

BigDon
2009-Feb-04, 09:06 PM
To me, the most important bagel question is not 75 cents versus 95 cents. The question is, is it really a bagel. A lot of what supermarkets sell as "bagels" are not bagels, but what I call "a roll with a hole". Bagels are very different than rolls and other bread.

The dough is different than regular bread dough, and bagels need to be boiled before they are baked. This webpage (http://joepastry.web.aplus.net/index.php?s=bagel) has a lot of details about bagel chemistry, but this is the key part:

Exactly! That was what I was saying about the baker's on my ship being so bad they were getting this result by accident!

While attempting to make hamburger buns, which are supposed to be lighter than even regular sandwich bread!

Gillianren
2009-Feb-05, 08:03 PM
Not just your local-ish. I've seen these (http://www.sunsweet.com/products/info.asp?product=ones) (or something like it) advertised recently.

Pfft. Those aren't prunes. It says right there. "Dried plums." That's obviously totally different!

Trebuchet
2009-Feb-05, 08:03 PM
US$1.10 per bagel in the company cafeteria downstairs. $0.30 extra for cream cheese. Seems a bit high to me as well.

kleindoofy
2009-Feb-05, 08:12 PM
Oy vay! ;)

BigDon
2009-Feb-05, 09:23 PM
One of the hidden gems in the area is a restarant that sprang up to answer the demand for East Coast style fare and portions, specifically from the Jewish ethnic burroughs. (And it sounds like you're eating on the sound stage of The Nanny sometimes.)

You order a bagel and creme cheese and it comes so loaded with creme cheese I often can't finish it, I can't eat that much of it at one sitting. And after you become a regular they start being even nicer.

Click Ticker
2009-Feb-05, 09:43 PM
Three bagels for breakfast? Even plain - that seems like alot of food in one sitting. Especially just loading up on bread. I'm not a small person by any stretch.

Neverfly
2009-Feb-05, 11:27 PM
Three bagels for breakfast? Even plain - that seems like alot of food in one sitting. Especially just loading up on bread. I'm not a small person by any stretch.

You haven't seen me pack away the goods.
5'6" and 140 lbs. I will eat two foot long subs from subway and still be hungry. I can eat two LARGE pizzas, an entire turkey (including all the fixins'), 6 MRE's etc- all in one sitting per item.
An hour later, I'm hungry again.

I had a stunned waiter at Marie Calenders say, "You just don't give up do you?"

Don't ask me what happens at Buffets.


This is the primary reason that I know the crazy claims that the LHC will destroy the world are bogus. I have several of those mini gobstobbers floating around in my midsection and they haven't destroyed the world yet.

pghnative
2009-Feb-05, 11:42 PM
I don't think they are telling the hole story.Give them time....they'll get a-round to it.

Click Ticker
2009-Feb-06, 02:32 PM
You haven't seen me pack away the goods.
5'6" and 140 lbs. I will eat two foot long subs from subway and still be hungry. I can eat two LARGE pizzas, an entire turkey (including all the fixins'), 6 MRE's etc- all in one sitting per item.
An hour later, I'm hungry again.

I had a stunned waiter at Marie Calenders say, "You just don't give up do you?"

Don't ask me what happens at Buffets.


This is the primary reason that I know the crazy claims that the LHC will destroy the world are bogus. I have several of those mini gobstobbers floating around in my midsection and they haven't destroyed the world yet.


I don't burn it like I used to. Sedentary job and too busy lately to make time to run, unless I want to function on six hours sleep - which is another thing I don't do very well.

But you are correct. 10 or 15 years ago - three bagles would be a between meals snack, and I'd lose weight in the process.

dodecahedron
2009-Feb-06, 08:14 PM
dodecahedron,

Even if you don't get out very often and haven't bought bagels in a bagel
shop in a long time, you still must eat every day.

I've gone out of my way to live the life of a hermit. Most of the stuff I buy I'm aware of the prices and really don't go out of my way to look for new stuff therefore I'm intentionally oblivious to other changes. Heck I still remember when bagels were 35 cents back in New Jersey. Also 9/10, my good man.


95 cents per bagel? :confused: What is that store making them out of, gold powder? :(

moar liek gold bond powder amirite? They were from a chain store called Brueggers and there's only one good bagel shop in Colorado Springs and I gotta hike to get there. Playing Devil's Advocate I'm sure their business plan isn't geared towards selling single bagels and the lion's share of profit is made with their sandwiches.


The question is, is it really a bagel. A lot of what supermarkets sell as "bagels" are not bagels, but what I call "a roll with a hole".

At my old job sometimes the department manager would announce that she bought bagels for the team. The first few times I was like "HOT DАМN" followed by abject disappointment finding a bag of Thomas's bagels from the supermarket. One time I confronted her with "I thought you bought bagels" which only led to a confused stare. They really don't know any better outside of the northeast but you gotta love them because it can be charming at times.


Three bagels for breakfast? Even plain - that seems like alot of food in one sitting. Especially just loading up on bread. I'm not a small person by any stretch.

Dude, I'm 300+ pounds and 6'2". If you want to talk about gluttony I'm your man. 20 inch pizza in one sitting. A loaf of garlic bread from the supermarket for lunch. Stuff like that. Mind you it's not on a regular basis but taking those feats into consideration eating three bagels in a row doesn't take much in the way of intestinal fortitude. Then again I bike a lot and try not to be sedentary. If only I was more like Kingpin of Marvel Comics fame.

Swift
2009-Feb-06, 08:30 PM
As an authority on bagels :D (I was born and raised in New York City and am ethnically Jewish), I would say Brueggers are real bagels, and pretty good for a chain. $0.95 sounds about right to me.

dodecahedron
2009-Feb-07, 01:40 AM
As an authority on bagels :D (I was born and raised in New York City and am ethnically Jewish), I would say Brueggers are real bagels, and pretty good for a chain. $0.95 sounds about right to me.

Good Moderator! I challenge you upon your urban heritage. A true denizen of the tri-state area would be far more inclined to patronize a locally owned business rather than a chain!

nauthiz
2009-Feb-07, 01:59 AM
Bagels & Co., in Manhattan on Amsterdam Ave. near the natural history museum.

Swift
2009-Feb-07, 04:48 AM
Good Moderator! I challenge you upon your urban heritage. A true denizen of the tri-state area would be far more inclined to patronize a locally owned business rather than a chain!
I throw myself on the mercy of the court. I haven't lived in NYC for almost 30 years. In the Cleveland metro area, there are about 2 local bagel bakeries of any worth, and they are both a solid 45 minute drive from my house. So you do what you got to do.

And the bagel situation is ten times better than the pizza crisis - pah-lease, don't get me started. ;)

Jeff Root
2009-Feb-07, 12:31 PM
Heck I still remember when bagels were 35 cents back in New Jersey.
I remember when a loaf of bread was 35 cents. Thirty-something,
anyway, but I think it was 35. It was that price throughout most
of my childhood. I recently paid $3.89 for a loaf of bread when it
wasn't at a reduced price.

-- Jeff, in Minneapolis

Sam5
2009-Feb-08, 03:30 AM
Is 95 cents for a single plain bagel the current average? I thought bagels would be more like 60 cents.


I got to thinking about your thread today, when I was in the grocery store, so I bought a big bag of 6 large bagles for about $2.65.

I'm going to go toast one now and have it with cream cheese. Yum, yum.

dodecahedron
2009-Feb-08, 09:38 PM
And the bagel situation is ten times better than the pizza crisis

Pizza crisis? There's a pizza crisis? Meaning pizza's become outrageously expensive or the pickens are lean in your neck of the woods?

Swift
2009-Feb-09, 04:00 PM
Pizza crisis? There's a pizza crisis? Meaning pizza's become outrageously expensive or the pickens are lean in your neck of the woods?
The second one. It is close to impossible to get good, NY style pizza around here. And it is a crisis only for me.

Ara Pacis
2009-Feb-10, 07:46 AM
The second one. It is close to impossible to get good, NY style pizza around here. And it is a crisis only for me.

If it could be found outside of NY it wouldn't be called NY-style. Just like how you can't get good Chicago-style pizza outside of Chicago.

BigDon
2009-Feb-10, 08:45 AM
Ah, Di Napoli's Restaurant!

3 blocks down the street. Food so good the numbers on my speed dialer. I'm rather fond of thier squid. When I have the kids over it's pizza night of course, which is just freakin' fabulous. The only problem with thier lasagna is it's too rich for my tastes. A rare fault. I'm sure others may not see it that way.

Walk-in menu is different from thier delivery menu and also fabulous.

EricM407
2009-Feb-10, 03:48 PM
I still never got an answer I asked in another thread on how, considering all the gyrations one has to go through to make a bagel, how the bakers on my ship would make them by accident while shooting for hamburger buns.

That's really inexplicable. I've made funny shaped things that taste like bagel while trying to make pretzels though. Turns out that if you try to do pretzels the easy fake way, it's pretty much bagels.

Gillianren
2009-Feb-10, 07:54 PM
If it could be found outside of NY it wouldn't be called NY-style. Just like how you can't get good Chicago-style pizza outside of Chicago.

That doesn't follow. Hence the word "style." You can't get New York pizza outside New York by definition, but you can get New York-style pizza in other places.

nauthiz
2009-Feb-10, 07:58 PM
Besides, the best Chicago-style pizza I've had was from a pizzeria in Wisconsin.

ABR.
2009-Feb-10, 08:37 PM
Here's another pizza shout out: Villa Napoli in Arvada, Colorado. Their Sicilian brought a smile to a buddy who is probably the snobbiest East Coast pizza afficianado anywhere.

pghnative
2009-Feb-10, 08:40 PM
That doesn't follow. Hence the word "style." You can't get New York pizza outside New York by definition, but you can get New York-style pizza in other places.
Hmmm. Seems to me you need both. You need it to be available only in New York for at least some time. That's the best way to get the product associated with the location. Then you need it to be available elsewhere, so that the "style" appendage makes sense.


Besides, the best Chicago-style pizza I've had was from a pizzeria in Wisconsin.Isn't Wisconsin just a suburb of Chicago??

<<ducks, and runs for cover>>

nauthiz
2009-Feb-10, 09:53 PM
Isn't Wisconsin just a suburb of Chicago??

Only during the warm months.

Ara Pacis
2009-Feb-11, 08:09 AM
That doesn't follow. Hence the word "style." You can't get New York pizza outside New York by definition, but you can get New York-style pizza in other places.

You're not following. If pizza made in New York were indistinguishable from pizza made outside of new York, then it would probably not be called NY-style. However, pizza made in New York appears to be distinguishable, hence the appellation and imitations.

SeanF
2009-Feb-11, 03:01 PM
You're not following. If pizza made in New York were indistinguishable from pizza made outside of new York, then it would probably not be called NY-style. However, pizza made in New York appears to be distinguishable, hence the appellation and imitations.
If a New York pizza operator were to move to Chicago, open a restaurant, and make the exact same pizza he had been making in New York, would you call it "New York pizza" (even though it's not being made in New York) or "New York-style pizza" (because it's made in the same style as the pizza made in New York)?

nauthiz
2009-Feb-11, 03:03 PM
You're not following. If pizza made in New York were indistinguishable from pizza made outside of new York, then it would probably not be called NY-style. However, pizza made in New York appears to be distinguishable, hence the appellation and imitations.

The folks who say that there's anything special to the pizza in New York City (other than that a certain style, named for the city, is popular there) are, in my experience, usually the same folks who are saying their pizza recreates the fabled authentic flavor because they get their water trucked in from Manhattan. The super secret being, of course, that what makes New York style what it is is some chemical X in the groundwater.



The real reason it's called New York style is that only New Yorkers can tolerate the stuff. ducks

Swift
2009-Feb-11, 04:05 PM
The real reason it's called New York style is that only New Yorkers can tolerate the stuff. ducks
Absolutely correct and that's fine - more for me! :p

As to the rest of the debate about "NY style pizza" - oh my gosh, you people make my head spin. Imagine if those people who debated about the number of angels on the head of a pin had an Internet forum. http://www.websmileys.com/sm/crazy/686.gif

nauthiz
2009-Feb-11, 04:12 PM
BTW - does anyone know where there's a decent bagel to be had in Chicago?

The place everyone I've talked to recommends is some joint whose claim to fame is that they get their bagels shipped in from H&H in New York. Frankly, I'm not sure how I feel about paying twice as much for day-old bagels.

Nick Theodorakis
2009-Feb-11, 04:19 PM
The thing with bagels, is that they are much better fresh. I can't imagine a shipped bagel from NYC is going to be better than fresh-made bagel in another city. It's not like the recipe is a secret or even very complicated.

As for pizza, I like all kinds of pizza: Chicago (both the regular deep dish and the stuffed), NY, thin, thick, cripsy, or doughy, simple, or complicated, I revel in the glorious diverstity of all comestibles that are called "pizza." I even (or expecially) like it with anchovies!

Nick

ABR.
2009-Feb-11, 05:36 PM
http://www.websmileys.com/sm/crazy/686.gif

Swift...when's the last time you've had your eyes checked? Or is this what Mike was talking about in another thread, you know, the eyes going digital and such?

ETA: Wow. It's mesmerizing. This must be the hypno-smiley. All bow to the hypno-smiley.

Swift
2009-Feb-11, 05:53 PM
ETA: Wow. It's mesmerizing. This must be the hypno-
smiley. All bow to the hypno-smiley.
You are bowing to the wrong hypno. BOW! (http://dcairns.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/hypnotoad.jpg)

ABR.
2009-Feb-11, 06:03 PM
You are bowing to the wrong hypno. BOW! (http://dcairns.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/hypnotoad.jpg)

Yes, Master!
Ribbet!

nauthiz
2009-Feb-11, 06:05 PM
This one (http://r33b.net/) has the sound for added authenticity.

closetgeek
2009-Feb-12, 09:06 PM
The second one. It is close to impossible to get good, NY style pizza around here. And it is a crisis only for me.

You know what? The last time I went to NY I couldn't find a good NY style pizza. They are cutting corners and ruining the whole thing.


The thing with bagels, is that they are much better fresh. I can't imagine a shipped bagel from NYC is going to be better than fresh-made bagel in another city. It's not like the recipe is a secret or even very complicated.

Nick, we all beg to differ in this house. When ever we take a trip to NY, the day before I return to Fl, I overnight myself some Bagels, Kaiser rolls, and Italian bread because it just can't be replaced by anything down here. Shipped over-night, then frozen for three months, Italian bread is better then what they call Italian bread around here.

HenrikOlsen
2009-Feb-12, 09:23 PM
Imagine if those people who debated about the number of angels on the head of a pin had an Internet forum.
It's 17. What's there to debate?

danscope
2009-Feb-21, 11:20 PM
BJ'S . Zeppy's bagels. Kettle boiled and oven fresh. Ten...count them;
10 enormous onion bagels for $3.49, in two separate bags. Freeze one and
consume the other. The price of Phil cream cheese was better as well.
But....ya have to get there before they are all gone. Plain and raisin are still there, but we crave the onion bagels. It''s like brownies. You can make them without walnuts but..... why bother?
Anyway, that's where I get my bagels. You have to hunt for them. They tend to push the store bakery stuff...$$$$$.
Best regards, Dan

mike alexander
2009-Feb-22, 12:22 AM
My wife is also a native New Yorker (Broadway and 170th St, Manhattan, to be precise) and she introduced me to bagels there back in the early 70's (Finding bagels in Cleveland then would have been pretty difficult).

A New York bagel cracks when you bend it, the crust is so hard. I have cut the inside of my mouth on a NY bagel on several occasions. And I've never encountered a schmeer so big I couldn't wolf it down. Like the pastrami sandwiches at the 2nd Ave Deli (may it rest in peace), just stretch your mouth farther.

NY pizza is, in my view, different from NY-style pizza because you aren't in New York. There was a pizza joint on the corner of 168th and Broadway, as I remember. We would stop by there coming back from downtown and grab a couple of slices, then stand around eating them, watching the M4 buses go by, the cabs play dodgem with the liveries, the guy with the old cardboard box doing three card monte, noise and bustling and diesel fumes. sort of the terrior of pizza.

NEOWatcher
2009-Feb-23, 06:23 PM
...bagels there back in the early 70's (Finding bagels in Cleveland then would have been pretty difficult).
Yes; He's not lying.
Although; a nice soft seeded rye bread with a crispy hot crust was the local favorite.

mike alexander
2009-Feb-23, 08:48 PM
And Italian bread. Alesci's made Italian loaves with a crust so hard you could hammer nails with 'em.

closetgeek
2009-Feb-23, 09:34 PM
And Italian bread. Alesci's made Italian loaves with a crust so hard you could hammer nails with 'em.

You're making my mouth water for Italian bread. they finally did a program about that, it really is all in the water. My plan is, instead of shipping NY dough down here and starting a NY bread shop, I am just going to have someone ship me tons of tap water.

Swift
2009-Feb-23, 09:51 PM
And Italian bread. Alesci's made Italian loaves with a crust so hard you could hammer nails with 'em.
You'll be happy to know that Alesci's (http://www.alescifoods.com/)is still around.

mike alexander
2009-Feb-23, 10:42 PM
You'll be happy to know that Alesci's (http://www.alescifoods.com/)is still around.

Well, something is still right in the world!

Sometimes on Saturdays I would ride my bike up to Ernie's Barber Shop on Mayfield for a quick cut ($0.50), then pedal down to Alesci's to pick up bread and lunchmeat for Mom. If you asked they would slice the salami so thin you could see through it, I swear. They had these Italian submarine rolls with the same crunchy crust that made a sandwich fit for Olympus.

EricM407
2009-Feb-23, 11:18 PM
You're making my mouth water for Italian bread. they finally did a program about that, it really is all in the water. My plan is, instead of shipping NY dough down here and starting a NY bread shop, I am just going to have someone ship me tons of tap water.

For those who didn't catch the program, what's in the water? Couldn't I just flavor my inferior midwestern water with it?

closetgeek
2009-Feb-24, 01:01 AM
For those who didn't catch the program, what's in the water? Couldn't I just flavor my inferior midwestern water with it?

That's an excellent question! Flouride, maybe? I know NY has a high level of flouride in the water. I know water is different all over the place, I just don't know what the difference is. In all honesty, I didn't catch the program either, I was just told that there was a show about it over the weekend.