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Thread: Crater marking to much or not enough

  1. #1
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    Crater marking to much or not enough





    Are the 3 big ones to faint or a just a dip ?

    In the bottom left , looks like there is a small faint cluster .

    Also , just boulder fields or mark singles to .

    High albedo ? Rays or anything looking lighter ?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Are the 3 big ones to faint or a just a dip ?
    Other than the biggest one, I agree with you. The biggest one ... really hard to tell. It may be obvious it is or isn't when the sun is closer to the horizon, but this is one of the things we're studying - where does the sun need to be to best identify craters? We'll see how many people agree with your markings as more people do the image.

    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    In the bottom left , looks like there is a small faint cluster.
    Yeah, again hard to tell in this sun angle. Which is again part of what we're studying.

    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Also, just boulder fields or mark singles to. High albedo? Rays or anything looking lighter?
    For now, boulder fields, not individual boulders. That may be another interface or task at some point. From recollection, there will only be boulders in <5% of the images that we selected for starters, and they're at the edge of Hadley Rille. High albedo features should be marked mainly for rays, but really any bright white splotches that you see. In the image above, I see a few speckles of white in perhaps fresher craters, but those are not big/broad enough for our interest in terms of what to mark albedo-feature-wise.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by astrostu View Post
    For now, boulder fields, not individual boulders. That may be another interface or task at some point. From recollection, there will only be boulders in <5% of the images that we selected for starters, and they're at the edge of Hadley Rille. High albedo features should be marked mainly for rays, but really any bright white splotches that you see. In the image above, I see a few speckles of white in perhaps fresher craters, but those are not big/broad enough for our interest in terms of what to mark albedo-feature-wise.
    Could you perhaps add a clarification on boulder fields and light albedo to the feature tutorial? Perhaps with some examples what not to mark...

    In the beginning, it was really hard for me to distinguish the white speckles from the interesting light albedo features. I am not sure how many people will then simply refer to the tutorial without asking their remaining questions here.

  4. #4
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    Thank you for that amazingly fast reply Stu . I noticed that placing your cursor tip just below the perceived center of the carter gets a more accurate placement for less changing tools . Liking this better by the min .

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    Didn't wana be the first to mark up the geo spot and I don't know if it'd fit there .

    I haven't been to the moon so this beer cooler looking thing isn't mine . And it's mighty big looking for a beer cooler, but quite rectangular . Top right in red .


  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by kmasterdo View Post
    Could you perhaps add a clarification on boulder fields and light albedo to the feature tutorial? Perhaps with some examples what not to mark...
    I'll look into this.

    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Didn't wana be the first to mark up the geo spot and I don't know if it'd fit there .

    I haven't been to the moon so this beer cooler looking thing isn't mine . And it's mighty big looking for a beer cooler, but quite rectangular . Top right in red .
    I did notice a few bright pixels when I processed these that actually threw off the image contrast (which is why for ~1/3 of these, I did the contrast manually). I would say, if you're unsure if something is interesting or not ('cause it could be Apollo hardware), go ahead and mark it. But if it's 1 or 2 white pixels with no hint of foot or rover tracks, it's more likely to be a hot pixel that wasn't taken care of in image processing.

    I haven't yet gone through the ~700ish features of interest that people marked, nor have I exactly figured out how I'm going to do it. I think what may happen is just like the craters, I'll rebuild the NAC in terms of interesting features and then just overlay it on the original image and see what's up.

  7. #7
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    Ran across another , feature now familiar . edit: 3

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    Beat the machine is a fixers paradise ! Took me a bit to get in the rhythm , but I finally settled into starting at a corner and bringing symmetry to chaos. About 1/2 way through I start to get a feeling of accomplishment . When finished there is a certain sense of satisfaction that I did not expect ! I think , with an advanced tutorial in methodology that this could be a hit . Not so much feathering the marker as in Craters . ( feathering the marker - Jussst going from red to green for marking min sized craters ) . Although feathering is slightly time consuming it does become an addicting challenge to get it right the first time . And personal progress is noticeable after every session . Really nice job guy's and guyette's .

  9. #9
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    Found it !




  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Found it !

    [image clipped]

    Amazing!!

  11. #11
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    Yup, thar be Apollo 15. For a different perspective on it, take a look at this blog post.

    You've found one of the sub-images NACs with Apollo 15. Now let's see if you can find the other 12.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Beat the machine is a fixers paradise ! Took me a bit to get in the rhythm , but I finally settled into starting at a corner and bringing symmetry to chaos. About 1/2 way through I start to get a feeling of accomplishment . When finished there is a certain sense of satisfaction that I did not expect ! I think , with an advanced tutorial in methodology that this could be a hit . Not so much feathering the marker as in Craters . ( feathering the marker - Jussst going from red to green for marking min sized craters ) . Although feathering is slightly time consuming it does become an addicting challenge to get it right the first time . And personal progress is noticeable after every session . Really nice job guy's and guyette's .
    Thanks. It being addicting is part of our intent ... we want people to stay! Just to be clear, though, in addition to just fixing the machine's markings, you're also supposed to be adding ones it missed and removing ones that aren't craters. Looking through the database, it looks like you're doing that, but I wanted to make it clear to anyone else reading this thread who got the wrong impression.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Found it !

    Congratulations!

  14. #14
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    Yes , me being the king of unclarity I can understand your concern . However , I have lived on De Yukon , And I have lived on De Kuskokwim , I've even lived on
    Da Little Pigeon River , but I have never lived on De'Nile . And I hope I haven't portrayed myself as a learned person , I just a guy with an eye .

    Thanks kmasterdo .

    I stopped by the Hangout last night for a little winding down . What a great Idea . And when the guy go's fishing on Titan I'm bringing the beer ! You'll have to watch to figure that one out . The whole thing " to me " is fascinating . How they figure things out an evr'stuff . And ya'll talk back , how cool is that ? This is going to be great when it gets into full swing .

    Also can't wait to see how Accurate my marks are so I can get to fine tuning my newly acquired knowledge .

  15. #15
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    Do I have to register something to report a bug to bugzilla , I have been noticing frequent sticky buttons ?

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    What in the moon is this ? Hairy rock ? I make out 4 stringy shadows coming off the higher albedo ... thing !

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    A bit more of Apollo 15 I presume .

  18. #18
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    Placidstorm - both of those are Apollo 15. In the first one, the sun was just about 7.5 above the horizon, so the shadows off the lander are incredibly long. In the second, you're looking at either rover or foot tracks; not sure what hardware your arrow is pointing to.

    Also, FYI, we added a link to the actual image (it's a tiny hyperlink due to lack of room). Right under the "Done Working" button, there's "Image Link" that you can click and it will take you to the image so you can link to it in the forum so you don't have to take screenshots 'n' such.

  19. #19
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    Cool !

  20. #20
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by placidstorm View Post
    Another A-15 ? ...Rover tracks ?
    Definitely and probably.

    P.S.: Could you use the "img" tags? Do [ img ] URL of image [ /img ] without the spaces and it should embed the image in the post.

  23. #23
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    What would be cool is some Apollo footage to go with these .



    P.S.: Could you use the "img" tags? Do [ img ] URL of image [ /img ] without the spaces and it should embed the image in the post.

    Just like this huh . . After reading introductions I feel a little like a pea on a grapevine . But (I R stil learntin stuff) .

  24. #24
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    EEk !! Lost my post and image tag . Have to file a bug on that .

    I can still ask the question though . I took some close ups .


    This one ( to me ) looks pretty concentric or bulls-eye .


    This one appears to simply be a smaller offset crater within a larger one .


    This one ( middle of the three ) has the rough flattish bottom .

    These are all min size or close to it . If I remember right the top is at min , the middle is under min . and the bottom is a few pixels larger than min .

    My question . Is the top one the only one to be considered " concentric " ?
    So far I've only been marking the ones that are at least as strong looking as the top one .

    As I understand it so far these are used for marking depth . ( I affectionally like to call them " depth charges" ).

  25. #25
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    I agree with the first one, second you can't tell, third just looks degraded to me. In terms of identifying craters, we have the minimum size. But considering that you can mark Apollo stuff, 2-pixel boulders, or any bright or dark albedo feature, I'd say go ahead and mark any interesting crater types regardless of size.

  26. #26
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    Ok thanks

  27. #27
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    Would this be classified as a boulder field ? In this instance I marked it as such . But mostly I've just been marking the big ones that take up a larger portion of the screen .




    On another note ... I saw the post you did on inverting the colors via the magnifier . Very very cool !! I did not know you could do that .
    It reminds me of my old " Salty Dog " days ( Navy ) back in the early to mid 80's . On our missile system we had a backup ( black and white ) camera to visually track incoming targets in the event the Directors went down . The camera had a reverse polarity feature on it for night use . We also used it on " man overboard " drills at night ( Not SOP at the time ) . Reason being , at sea your battle gear includes a pin on waterproof flashlight . In reverse polarity it appears like a big black splash in a sea of white .

    That got me wondering if you have ever tried using your algorithm in that manner , and if so what were the results .
    Also , do you have anymore cool tricks like that color inversion ?

  28. #28
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    Should we mark the rille rim as linear features ? They seem kind of self evident .

  29. #29
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    .................................................. v


    Marking features at the top of the image leaves nothing but the the bottom of the icon showing .

    For instance the crater at the top of the image annotated with the v . I marked an odd albedo feature on it and it can barely be seen . I mention this because you talked about hiding craters off the edge of the map and why you're halving the marks on the boarder now .

  30. #30
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    The sun hides craters .

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