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Thread: Window to the universe:

  1. #1
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    Window to the universe:

    Closing in on Einstein's window to the universe:

    (Phys.org) —Nearly a century after the world's greatest physicist, Albert Einstein, first predicted the existence of gravitational waves, a global network of gravitational wave observatories has moved a step closer to detecting the faint radiation that could lead to important new discoveries in our universe.

    David Blair is a Winthrop Professor of Physics at The University of Western Australia and Director of the Australian International Gravitational Research Centre at Gingin - 87km north of Perth. He leads the WA component of a huge international team that has announced a demonstration of a new measurement technique called 'quantum squeezing' that allows gravitational wave detectors to increase their sensitivity.

    Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2013-08-einstei...verse.html#jCp
    “Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were, but without it we go nowhere.”
    ― Carl Sagan

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    At what stage are we at with L.I.S.A.? [Laser Interferometer Space Atenna]
    When is it scheduled for launch? I have not heard too much about it in recent times.
    And could this technique be incorporated within that design?
    “Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were, but without it we go nowhere.”
    ― Carl Sagan

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    LISA has been put on hold, effectively, for an indefinite period of time. The US pulled out of the collaboration several years ago, and the European Space Agency has decided to ask scientists to re-design the mission.

    You can find out more at

    http://lisa.nasa.gov/
    http://sci.esa.int/lisa/48728-mission-status/

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    Quote Originally Posted by StupendousMan View Post
    LISA has been put on hold, effectively, for an indefinite period of time. The US pulled out of the collaboration several years ago, and the European Space Agency has decided to ask scientists to re-design the mission.

    You can find out more at

    http://lisa.nasa.gov/
    http://sci.esa.int/lisa/48728-mission-status/


    Shame about that....Thanks for the info.
    “Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were, but without it we go nowhere.”
    ― Carl Sagan

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    ...possibly... if it exists.

    The other thing they might discover is nothing.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    ...possibly... if it exists.

    The other thing they might discover is nothing.

    I see know reason why they would not exist, although discovering/finding them is another matter.
    We have verified the lense Thirring effect, and space/time curvature caused by mass, I don't see why other manifestations of warping would not occur.
    “Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were, but without it we go nowhere.”
    ― Carl Sagan

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    IHMO (well ... a little JUICE prejudiced) it was only good sense not to choose LISA, because that selection would have been made before "LISA Pathfinder" would have been started, which is the mission to show that they can actually do it technically.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASTRO BOY View Post
    I see know reason why they would not exist, although discovering/finding them is another matter.
    We have verified the lense Thirring effect, and space/time curvature caused by mass, I don't see why other manifestations of warping would not occur.
    Einstein said "use your imagination". Can't you imagine that they might be wrong?
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

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    One of the issues accompanying a huge increase in sensitivity is background noise. To accomodate that you need an increase in selectivity...bandwidth. though a challenge, fertile minds usually find a way. It is interesting to note that early detectors have found that the earth runs at about 1500 hz in an as yet inexplicable "hum".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    Einstein said "use your imagination". Can't you imagine that they might be wrong?
    Imagination is generally put in an optimistic sense....very rarely in the doomsayer/pessimistic context.
    “Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were, but without it we go nowhere.”
    ― Carl Sagan

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    Quote Originally Posted by ASTRO BOY View Post
    Imagination is generally put in an optimistic sense....very rarely in the doomsayer/pessimistic context.
    lolfail
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ASTRO BOY View Post
    Imagination is generally put in an optimistic sense....very rarely in the doomsayer/pessimistic context.
    Plus of course we all know that science in general advances through Imagination and Innovation, backed up by observation, experimentation and knowledge.
    It is really a crying shame we have participants that cannot see and/or are afraid to admit that fact.
    “Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were, but without it we go nowhere.”
    ― Carl Sagan

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    Quote Originally Posted by ASTRO BOY View Post
    Plus of course we all know that science in general advances through Imagination and Innovation, backed up by observation, experimentation and knowledge.
    It is really a crying shame we have participants that cannot see and/or are afraid to admit that fact.
    Whatever that hast to do with "imagination generally being optimistic".
    All comments made in red are moderator comments. Please, read the rules of the forum here, the special rules for the ATM section here and conspiracy theories. If you think a post is inappropriate, don't comment on it in thread but report it using the /!\ button in the lower left corner of each message. But most of all, have fun!

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    Gravity waves are an ensemble of gravitons of various energies. Trying to detect a gravity wave assuming it as a classical wave will fail. Gravitons do not propagate as photons in straight paths but they diffuse through space-time like heat and move with low drift velocities , the higher the graviton energy the lower the drift velocity. Therefore gravity wave information will take a long time to reach us from a distant astrophysical source than luminous information. Ergo trying to detect gravity waves using a classical detector is a futile exercise.
    Last edited by The Tunneller; 2013-Aug-07 at 03:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tunneller View Post
    Gravity waves are an ensemble of gravitons of various energies. Trying to detect a gravity wave assuming it as a classical wave will fail. Gravitons do not propagate as photons in straight paths but they diffuse through space-time like heat and move with low drift velocities , the higher the graviton energy the lower the drift velocity. Therefore gravity wave information will take a long time to reach us from a distant astrophysical source than luminous information. Ergo trying to detect gravity waves using a classical detector is a futile exercise.
    I did not appreciate that at all! So gravity waves spread like heat in a conductive sense, not radiation? And the more graviton energy the slower, but then at what speed does gravity itself operate?

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    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    I did not appreciate that at all! So gravity waves spread like heat in a conductive sense, not radiation? And the more graviton energy the slower, but then at what speed does gravity itself operate?
    Science progresses by asking the right questions and not mere appreciations.The question is how do they propagate. See gravitons see space-time as a lattice.the more energetic ones see a diminished spacetime lattice spacing. Therefore like phonons the graviton flux does not proceed in a striaght path but suffers frequent collisions with the lattice. even if their intrinsic speed was that of light, their collision frequency with the lattice would result in a slow drift speed. BTW did you know that a photon emited at the sun's core takes millions of years to escape from the sun's interior due to frequent collisions with solar plasma particles. The same applies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Tunneller View Post
    Gravity waves are an ensemble of gravitons of various energies. Trying to detect a gravity wave assuming it as a classical wave will fail. ...
    Heads up The Tunneller... you are both hijacking a thread, and posting "Against The Mainstream" (ATM) material in the mainstream part of this forum. You are new here, so this is only a warning, but you need to respect thread topics, and in this case, if you want to discuss your unusual model of gravitational prorogation, you'll need to create a new thread in the ATM section, and defend your model.
    Forming opinions as we speak

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    Quote Originally Posted by antoniseb View Post
    Heads up The Tunneller... you are both hijacking a thread, and posting "Against The Mainstream" (ATM) material in the mainstream part of this forum. You are new here, so this is only a warning, but you need to respect thread topics, and in this case, if you want to discuss your unusual model of gravitational prorogation, you'll need to create a new thread in the ATM section, and defend your model.
    My intention is not to hijack any thread at all but to illustrate why current gravity wave detectors fail. I did not realise that my opinion was against the mainstream. However having said that I will not discuss that any further nor start it as a topic in ATM

    Best regards
    Last edited by The Tunneller; 2013-Aug-08 at 01:17 AM.

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