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Thread: SpaceX

  1. #2101
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    Quote Originally Posted by docmordrid View Post
    Just the mass and slight leg tension from being grappled is enough.
    Pretty sure it lifts and levels the stage, rather than pulling it down, and contributes negligible mass, just rubber high-traction surfaces that get mashed firmly into the deck by the stage's weight.

  2. #2102
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    Expect a second ASDS droneship to arrive at Port Canaveral.

    This is expected to be Just Read the Instructions from LA because of the Vandenberg de-scoping, but there's an outside shot it's the new A Shortfall of Gravitas.

  3. #2103
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    Trevor Mahlmann @TrevorMahlmann
    GO Ms. Tree arrives at Port Canaveral in style! #FalconHeavy fairing on the deck. My first time seeing 'er. Stunning how ridiculously large those arms are.

    IMG_20190627_172150.jpg

    https://twitter.com/TrevorMahlmann/s...35248626098176

  4. #2104
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    More Starship & StarLink funding...

    https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/06/27/...this-year.html

    SpaceX raising over $300 million as new Ontario Teachers' tech fund makes its first investment

    SpaceX is seeking to raise $314.2 million at a price of $214 a share, according to a document seen by CNBC.

    Part, if not all, of the investment in SpaceX is from the Ontario Teachers' Pension Plan, which has $191.1 billion in assets under management.

    Before this latest round, SpaceX's valuation had risen to $33.3 billion, people familiar told CNBC in May.
    >

  5. #2105
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    Quote Originally Posted by docmordrid View Post
    Expect a second ASDS droneship to arrive at Port Canaveral.

    This is expected to be Just Read the Instructions from LA because of the Vandenberg de-scoping, but there's an outside shot it's the new A Shortfall of Gravitas.
    What are you saying?

  6. #2106
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    Quote Originally Posted by bknight View Post
    What are you saying?
    The number of commercial launches at Vandenberg will be reduced.

    A large part of this is because the Eastern Range is now able to do polar launches IF the vehicle has an autonomous flight termination/safety system (AFTS or AFSS). These systems reduce the staffing for a launch by about 100, and remove the human-in-the-loop with a big red button. Tracking is by GPS instead of radar. The range is also expanding, adding new pads to support high commercial flight rates.

    So far the only vehicles with AFTS/AFSS launching from the Cape are Falcon 9 and Falcon Heavy, with first use being CRS -10. Vulcan-Centaur, New Glenn, Starship and other launchers should get it in or after 2020.

    Another difficulty has been California environmental laws which make stage landings at LZ-4 difficult. Protect the seal's sensibilities, they say, among other things. The base is also not as willing to support high commercial flight rates. If there's a need for a Western Range USAF polar or retrograde orbit launch, fine.
    Last edited by docmordrid; 2019-Jun-28 at 06:54 AM.

  7. #2107
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    Quote Originally Posted by docmordrid View Post
    ...ULA complained it was their intellectual property. SpaceX is suing. Most analysts believe they have a good case given the misdeeds by Air Force staff. And the war continues.
    Ugh...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicolas View Post
    When F9H was first launched it had a bit of a "rocket without a mission" noise surrounding it, but meanwhile it has found 2 missions already so it seems that there is a healthy market for it.
    There for awhile, it looked like Delta II was becoming a real crutch. Argue for LV growth--and folks called you a nut.

  8. #2108
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    And now Falcon Heavy has several more flights manifested, two for the Air Force.

    But after that; the Starship Chomper is real

    Jonathan Hofeller, SpaceX VP of Commercial Sales.

    Starship: 100+ tonnes to LEO, 20 tonnes to GEO.

    Space News...

    SpaceX targets 2021 commercial Starship launch

    JAKARTA, Indonesia The first commercial mission for SpaceX's Starship and Super Heavy launch system will likely take place in 2021, a company executive said June 26.

    Jonathan Hofeller, SpaceXs vice president of commercial sales, said the company is in talks with prospective customers for the first commercial launch of that system roughly two years from now.

    "We are in discussions with three different customers as we speak right now to be that first mission," Hofeller said at the APSAT conference here. "Those are all telecom companies."
    >
    "We have future hops coming up later this year, he said. The goal is to get orbital as quickly as possible, potentially even this year, with the full stack operational by the end of next year and then customers in early 2021."
    >
    "You could potentially recapture a satellite and bring it down if you wanted to," Hofeller said. "It's very similar to the [space] shuttle bay in that regard. So we have this tool, and we are challenging the industry: what would you do with it?"
    >
    From April,

    NASA Goddard ✓ @NASAGoddard
    We asked and @SpaceX checked. The #LUVOIR space telescope concept can indeed fly on Starship! (graphic used by permission) https://t.co/ZVz9CbAp3F

    IMG_20190622_180751.jpg

    https://twitter.com/NASAGoddard/stat...10431969239040
    Last edited by docmordrid; 2019-Jun-28 at 11:12 PM.

  9. #2109
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    2021? I am just a tad skeptical, given that it is a new rocket, and supposed to be fully reusable at that. I would be very impressed with 2025.

    "The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." Abraham Lincoln

    I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

    The Leif Ericson Cruiser

  10. #2110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
    2021? I am just a tad skeptical, given that it is a new rocket, and supposed to be fully reusable at that. I would be very impressed with 2025.
    Methinks events at Boca Chica TX and Cocoa FL are moving way too fast for it to be that late, and this week Musk just announced another acceleration (and another big funding round.)

    They're building two Starships, one each in Texas and Florida, with known total ring segments approaching full height. Now to stack them. The crew/cargo modules are stacked save for the nose tips, and the propulsion modules are being stacked.

    They've also said the first Super Heavy booster build is to begin this summer, likely after the two Boca Chica Starship modules are joined. Further, the FAA test flight permits are in.

    This train's leaving the station.

  11. #2111
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    Well, we'll see. I'm certainly not going to complain if they manage to build and successfully fly it that fast, but it strikes me as a very short timetable considering there is a lot of new technology and novel construction involved on a new rocket. They're very early in the test phase after all. Five or six years to complete testing and go to operational commercial missions would itself be fast for new rocket development.

    Frankly, I'll be very happy if they manage to continue development without hitting any showstoppers and having to back up and make large redesigns.

    "The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." Abraham Lincoln

    I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

    The Leif Ericson Cruiser

  12. #2112
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    Mary @BocaChicaGal
    A pic taken this evening at the Boca Chica Starship Assembly area. I can't wait to see the completed Starship orbital prototype. It's exciting to watch the progress being made every single day. ������@NASASpaceflighthttps://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/in...943#msg1961943
    10:03 PM - Jun 30, 2019

    IMG_20190630_224808.jpg

    https://twitter.com/BocaChicaGal/sta...13114454114306

  13. #2113
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    StarHopper schedule

    Reagan Beck @bluemoondance74
    UPDATE: ICYMI- Newest delays of road/ beach closures in Boca Chica, TX to begin Thursday, July 11 (2-8 pm), with alternate days July 12-13, for SpaceX #Starhopper tests and expected hops ������ (Big thank you to @Maximpokaz ��)

    https://twitter.com/bluemoondance74/...56599949398017

  14. #2114
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    The Boca Chica magical mystery structure's getting quite large. Assembly structure? Storm protection? Hmmmm...

    https://youtu.be/iohBZk2hxS4

  15. #2115
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    Maybe Musk isn't building an interplanetary launch vehicle but instead a campy theme park?

  16. #2116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicolas View Post
    Maybe Musk isn't building an interplanetary launch vehicle but instead a campy theme park?
    Super-Villain lair.

  17. #2117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicolas View Post
    Maybe Musk isn't building an interplanetary launch vehicle but instead a campy theme park?
    So, the mystery structure is the gift shop?



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I may have many faults, but being wrong ain't one of them. - Jimmy Hoffa

  18. #2118
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    When he said riding Starship would be a bit like Space Mountain, he meant just that.

  19. #2119
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    They're also using stacked & welded cargo containers to define two rectangular construction bays. Perhaps ring segments, domes, whatever.

    This type of low-cost construction is becoming rather common.

    https://www.discovercontainers.com/7...ontainer-home/

  20. #2120
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    Quote Originally Posted by docmordrid View Post
    They're also using stacked & welded cargo containers to define two rectangular construction bays. Perhaps ring segments, domes, whatever.

    This type of low-cost construction is becoming rather common.

    https://www.discovercontainers.com/7...ontainer-home/
    Not for Rocket Surgery, I think!

    I'd almost like to think Musk is just having a laugh at our expense, while the real Starship is being built of Unobtanium in a Sooper-Seekrit high tech clean room at Area 52. Almost.

    And then it occurs to me: Musk also sells cars. Would you buy a car that was being built the way these rocket ships are?
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  21. #2121
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    Yes, I really don't know what to make of the low-precision welded steel shells. My guess is they're testing construction procedures while keeping up interest with investors, and that may be all the current shells are for. But if they plan to use these shells for hop tests, I'm curious how they would integrate tanks and engines.

    I would be astonished if they tried to build the actual orbital rockets this way (that is, building a non-precision shell outside somewhere and later integrate the rest of the rocket hardware).

    "The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." Abraham Lincoln

    I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

    The Leif Ericson Cruiser

  22. #2122
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    Okay, looking it up, I guess they have done some integration for a hop test, but don't have an engine in yet.

    "The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." Abraham Lincoln

    I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

    The Leif Ericson Cruiser

  23. #2123
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    Starhopper has been mated to an engine mutiple times. If they put the Starship prototypes on their (yet to be added) feet, they'd have the bottom clearance to add the engines. they are supposed to be orbital prototypes. But it does make you wonder: for starters, there is no launch platform at Cocoa or Boca at the moment. And Starship is a big thing to launch.

    Given it's Musk, I'm willing to believe what we see is actual flight hardware for the orbital prototypes. But I also assume that the actual production vehicles will be built in something that looks more like a production line, with more automation/preforming. The lessons learned from building these prototypes will be very valuable input for that.

  24. #2124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
    Yes, I really don't know what to make of the low-precision welded steel shells. My guess is they're testing construction procedures while keeping up interest with investors, and that may be all the current shells are for. But if they plan to use these shells for hop tests, I'm curious how they would integrate tanks and engines.

    I would be astonished if they tried to build the actual orbital rockets this way (that is, building a non-precision shell outside somewhere and later integrate the rest of the rocket hardware).
    The "shell" comprises the bulk of the tanks and the vast majority of the rocket. There aren't separate tanks to integrate (apart from small pressure vessels and eventual nested header tanks), just interior bulkheads between the tanks and capping each end. We've seen them install such things on the Hopper.

    The ones under construction now are the orbital prototypes. It's possible the first attempts will be scrapped as they learn how to build them, but they're made of steel and can be reworked relatively easily, they don't have to be perfect the first time. Also, the mirror finish exaggerates the tiniest deviations from a flat surface.


    Quote Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
    Okay, looking it up, I guess they have done some integration for a hop test, but don't have an engine in yet.
    They installed an engine and did test fires with the Hopper back in April, with a tightly-tethered hop of a few cm. They're working on getting things ready for a free flight test now.

  25. #2125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
    Not for Rocket Surgery, I think!

    I'd almost like to think Musk is just having a laugh at our expense, while the real Starship is being built of Unobtanium in a Sooper-Seekrit high tech clean room at Area 52. Almost.

    And then it occurs to me: Musk also sells cars. Would you buy a car that was being built the way these rocket ships are?
    Musk builds cars in a giant tent, and quite a few people are buying them. We build $13 billion aircraft carriers the way they're building these rocket ships.

    You can't haul Starships into cleanrooms every time you need to do some maintenance or repairs. If you can only build one in a cleanroom, you've already failed at making a vehicle robust enough and cheap enough to operate to do what Starship needs to do.

  26. #2126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
    Yes, I really don't know what to make of the low-precision welded steel shells.
    The StarHopper was manually welded, but the Starships are being built using automated seam welders and are x-rayed. Seam welders are made for outdoor use.

    My guess is they're testing construction procedures while keeping up interest with investors, and that may be all the current shells are for. But if they plan to use these shells for hop tests, I'm curious how they would integrate tanks and engines.
    Nope. Flight hardware.

    And don't be fooled by the irregular reflections. Shiny surfaces exaggerate irregularities, and in many cases what looks like corrosion is a thin protective film - often scorched during welding.

    They also haven't finished grinding & polishing the welds, some of which are mid-panel. There are also dark spots from internal welds which also need re-polishing.

  27. #2127
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    STP-2 fairing on its way down to Ms. Tree

    It had a camera, and it shows the plasma trail behind the fairing on the way down. The two holes which open up, creating additional plasma streams, are normal.

    SpaceX-rocket-fairing-plasma-480.jpg

    https://twitter.com/SpaceX/status/1146546495241371649
    Last edited by docmordrid; 2019-Jul-05 at 01:42 AM.

  28. #2128
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    This

    https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2019...nches-pad-39a/

    Goes with

    Thomas Burghardt @TGMetsFan98
    SpaceX has a new job posting for "Launch Engineer, Starship Operations" in Cape Canaveral:

    "The Cape Starship Operations Engineer...for Starship and Super Heavy vehicle development and initial launch capability from Launch Pad 39A."

    https://boards.greenhouse.io/spacex/...medium=ios_app
    5:05 PM - Jul 4, 2019

    RESPONSIBILITIES:

    * Assist in the design and development of mechanical and fluid launch systems for the Starship and Super Heavy vehicle at our Cape Canaveral launch site

    * Develop novel ways site wide to streamline processes and increase the reliability of Starship operations

    * Projects will range from site development for fabrication, automated welding systems, launch pad fluid systems, to small custom valves for fluid systems, test fixtures, and automated mechanisms

    * Use your well-rounded technical knowledge to display proficiency in basic structural sizing, mechanisms, and design while making development decisions based on cost and schedule considerations

    * Directly support the fabrication of tooling and ground support equipment at the launch site facilities

    * Collaborate with both design and fabrication engineering

    * Ensure that all parts are received and inspected at the correct time to facilitate the build schedule

    * Participate in tool design and development

    * Develop production, activation, and operations procedures/processes

    * Resolve manufacturing discrepancies and interface with the cross functional teams
    https://twitter.com/TGMetsFan98/stat...87854334926863
    Last edited by docmordrid; 2019-Jul-05 at 02:29 AM.

  29. #2129
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    So construction will move from Cocoa (/Boca) to Canaveral. What are they going to do wit the prototype in Cocoa though, is it realistic to move to 39A? Over water maybe?

  30. #2130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicolas View Post
    So construction will move from Cocoa (/Boca) to Canaveral. What are they going to do wit the prototype in Cocoa though, is it realistic to move to 39A? Over water maybe?
    Builds/flights will be at both sites, with Starships Mk-1 and Mk-2 being built now. The question about Boca Chica for Super Heavy flights in that April article may be overstated, and Starship can fly by itself - no booster.

    They're also working on a SpaceX Operations Area at KSC between the Visitors Center and Vehicle Assembly Building in Roberts Road. 60+ acres; hangar, shops, firing room, observation tower, rocket farm, etc. etc.

    KSC SpaceX Operations Area map.jpg
    Last edited by docmordrid; 2019-Jul-05 at 03:03 PM.

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