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Thread: Antarctica Ice Sheet to collapse, but not quickly

  1. #31
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    LookingSkyward is offline Honored Member
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    ^^heh!^^

  2. #32
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    Darn it, those two just baffle me some days.
    Surprised I didn't get ****'d out by the autocensor.
    Last edited by Squink; 2014-May-29 at 01:14 PM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    Yes I agree with all that. The ice near the edges is of course warmed from the sea underneath. My point is that vast amounts of ice will reduce the sea temperature close to 0 which is a negative feedback effect.
    IIRC, deep sea temperature (90% of the world ocean volume), at depth and near the arctic, is already near 0°. Ice may, of course, be colder than that and need to be warmed up before melting. However, the ice doesn't have to melt to raise sea level. It can slide off into the ocean to displace water while remaining solid.

    Also, the Antarctic/Southern Ocean circulation may isolate the region from warming in the midlatitudes, tropics, and arctic ocean, which will probably experience thermal expansion from warming. One extrapolation that uses a doubling of CO2 estimates MSL will rise by 1 m in 500 years and reach 1.9 at equilibrium, while a quadrupling of CO2 will raise MSL by 1.75 m in 500 years.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  4. #34
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    Thwaites Glacier Under Geothermal Assault:

    Researchers Find Major West Antarctic Glacier Melting from Geothermal Sources
    This map shows the locations of geothermal flow underneath Thwaites Glacier in West Antarctica that were identified with airborne ice-penetrating radar. The dark magenta triangles show where geothermal flow exceeds 150 milliwatts per square meter, and the light magenta triangles show where flow exceeds 200 milliwatts per square meter. Letters C, D and E denote high melt areas
    Regarding modelling:
    “It’s the most complex thermal environment you might imagine,” said co-author Don Blankenship, a senior research scientist at UTIG and Schroeder’s Ph.D. adviser. “And then you plop the most critical dynamically unstable ice sheet on planet Earth in the middle of this thing, and then you try to model it. It’s virtually impossible.”
    PNAS article

  5. #35
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    Unfortunately I read the comments and they confirm my concern that people will take this and run with it and use it to try to explain away global warming.
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  6. #36
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    They'd use rubber duckies to do that if they could.
    Fact is, these heat flow measurements just show us that the system is likely twitchier than we had heretofore believed.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    IIRC, deep sea temperature (90% of the world ocean volume), at depth and near the arctic, is already near 0°. Ice may, of course, be colder than that and need to be warmed up before melting. However, the ice doesn't have to melt to raise sea level. It can slide off into the ocean to displace water while remaining solid.

    Also, the Antarctic/Southern Ocean circulation may isolate the region from warming in the midlatitudes, tropics, and arctic ocean, which will probably experience thermal expansion from warming. One extrapolation that uses a doubling of CO2 estimates MSL will rise by 1 m in 500 years and reach 1.9 at equilibrium, while a quadrupling of CO2 will raise MSL by 1.75 m in 500 years.
    I think deep water is at 4 the anomalous max density point, but salinity also is a big factor. Fresh water at 0 floats
    Last edited by profloater; 2014-Jun-12 at 08:28 PM.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    I think deep water is at 4 the anomalous max density point, but salinity also is a big factor. Fresh water at 0 floats
    http://www.windows2universe.org/earth/Water/temp.html

    90 % of the total volume of ocean is found below the thermocline in the deep ocean. The deep ocean is not well mixed. The deep ocean is made up of horizontal layers of equal density. Much of this deep ocean water is between 0-3 degrees Celsius (32-37.5 degrees Fahrenheit)! It's really, really cold down there!
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  9. #39
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    Ok so deep it's salty but the surface is at 0 too and above the 4 level which must get depressed. The latent heat still acts as negative feedback for more melting.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    Unfortunately I read the comments and they confirm my concern that people will take this and run with it and use it to try to explain away global warming.
    That's why one should never read online comments.

  11. #41
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    I just wish I could scoop out a big hole in the Sahara and put it all there, where it would be needed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by publiusr View Post
    I just wish I could scoop out a big hole in the Sahara and put it all there, where it would be needed.
    Do you refer to ice, or to a way to rid ourselves of AGW deniers who comment on articles?
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

  13. #43
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    Take your pick.

    But it would be nice to have a lot of fresh water on hand...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ara Pacis View Post
    Do you refer to ice, or to a way to rid ourselves of AGW deniers who comment on articles?
    Rather than commentors, let's put denier politicians in the hole first and then add the ice.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
    Rather than commentors, let's put denier politicians in the hole first and then add the ice.


    I never knew you were a bartender...

  16. #46
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    Three politicians walk into a bar... Knock themselves right out. What, you were expecting a politician with vision?
    Et tu BAUT? Quantum mutatus ab illo.

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