Page 57 of 61 FirstFirst ... 7475556575859 ... LastLast
Results 1,681 to 1,710 of 1810

Thread: The COVID-19 Discussion Thread (OTB)

  1. #1681
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Depew, NY
    Posts
    12,632
    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Yes, it must be miserable working at the CDC at present, with various motives being imputed for every tiny modification of policy, and doubly so when it comes to the positively radioactive topic of face-coverings.
    Meanwhile, Ohio's motivational "Vax-A-Million" lottery has made headlines in the UK.

    Grant Hutchison
    They really need to dispense with the sanity for people who have been vaccinated: "Look. With the vaccine, you may A) stop wearing a mask under most conditions or B) finish the ninja costume. Please carry on as you see fit."

    Personally, I'm on Team Ninja.
    Solfe

  2. #1682
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    No longer near Grover's Mill
    Posts
    5,638
    I just checked with my stateís online immunization records, and they have the correct info for our COVID-19 vaccinations (not so much for the flu). This is where anyone who needs proof of my vaccination will find it. (Presumably with permission)

    The card is nice, but worthless as proof.

    So far, nobody is asking.
    I may have many faults, but being wrong ain't one of them. - Jimmy Hoffa

  3. #1683
    I don't get why people just don't get the vaccine, there is no microchip in it they already have a way of tracking you called a smartphone, but for some reason I am getting a lot of ads for microsoft over the last couple of days.
    From the wilderness into the cosmos.
    You can not be afraid of the wind, Enterprise: Broken Bow.
    https://davidsuniverse.wordpress.com/

  4. #1684
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,792
    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    They really need to dispense with the sanity for people who have been vaccinated: "Look. With the vaccine, you may A) stop wearing a mask under most conditions or B) finish the ninja costume. Please carry on as you see fit."

    Personally, I'm on Team Ninja.
    Umm. OK.
    In my part of the world, just saying, "If you get this vaccine it will help prevent you, your loved ones, and complete strangers from dying of Covid," seems to work just fine. We keep hitting vaccinations rates of 97-100% as we go down through the age groups. It's remarkable.

    Grant Hutchison

  5. #1685
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    The Great NorthWet
    Posts
    17,098
    My niece, the daughter we never had, suggested we come see them at the cabin by the ocean this weekend. Not only is it too far, her husband's family will all be there. Perhaps including his anti-vaxxer daughter. Sure we've been vaccinated. So have my niece and her husband. But we still wouldn't feel safe. It's frustrating.
    And I'd love to go out to eat in a restaurant, but my wife's not ready.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  6. #1686
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Depew, NY
    Posts
    12,632
    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Umm. OK.
    In my part of the world, just saying, "If you get this vaccine it will help prevent you, your loved ones, and complete strangers from dying of Covid," seems to work just fine. We keep hitting vaccinations rates of 97-100% as we go down through the age groups. It's remarkable.

    Grant Hutchison
    Up until this morning, we had mask chaos. My locality wasn't really happy to follow the CDC advisory on masks. There is also no way to pull data on how many people are completely vaccinated from the state website. "At Least One Dose" is less than transparent. As I understand it, my area is at less than 50% fully vaccinated from news sources.

    My household is fully vaccinated. I'm still wearing a mask because a lot of my coworkers haven't had their first shot yet. It isn't like I actually understand the threat of a fully vaccinated person mixing with an unvaccinated person. But going through the motions encourages those not yet protected to continue doing what they were doing to stay safe. Edit - I seem to know zero people who had the flu this year. Masks do something good.
    Solfe

  7. #1687
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,792
    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    Edit - I seem to know zero people who had the flu this year. Masks do something good.
    Flu vaccinations do something good. Social distancing and lockdowns do something good. Closing schools really does something good. The evidence for whether masks do something good for flu is actually a bit inconsistent.

    Grant Hutchison

  8. #1688
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Nowhere (middle)
    Posts
    39,519
    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Flu vaccinations do something good. Social distancing and lockdowns do something good. Closing schools really does something good. The evidence for whether masks do something good for flu is actually a bit inconsistent.
    Right. No one factor happens in isolation. A lot of the mainstream articles and social media arguments tend to forget this fact. The more protective elements that work in concert the better.

    But that's the way our minds are trained to work these days; ignore complexity, boil everything down to simple talking points; mask or no mask, a binary black or white, with or against. It makes it easier to polarize which drives clicks and views in the professional outrage and fearmonger industries... which may not be a deliberate result of the way mainstream reporting and viral (no pun) media work, but it is the result nevertheless.

    The resulting informational mess disrupts and confuses rational decision making in many individuals and groups and feeds vaccine "hesitation" and conspiracy theories. It actively discourages careful, dispassionate analysis of the facts and reinforces emotional, biased reactions that are then quickly amplified and entrenched.
    "I'm planning to live forever. So far, that's working perfectly." Steven Wright

  9. #1689
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Depew, NY
    Posts
    12,632
    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Flu vaccinations do something good. Social distancing and lockdowns do something good. Closing schools really does something good. The evidence for whether masks do something good for flu is actually a bit inconsistent.

    Grant Hutchison
    I knew about the school thing having worked at several. There is really dark time in February where you know you're going to get sick. I didn't know that masks were not proven against the flu.
    Solfe

  10. #1690
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Norfolk UK and some of me is in Northern France
    Posts
    9,919
    We have to remember there were people who wore masks before, mainly to filter out pollution and people who avoided giving and receiving contagious disease by avoiding handshaking and excessive hugging. There is a spectrum of cultural disease control in different societies. Hopefully modern technology will do away with the more extreme examples where strangers are just not welcome.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  11. #1691
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Norfolk UK and some of me is in Northern France
    Posts
    9,919
    Duplicate post.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  12. #1692
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    20,213
    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    Duplicate post.
    You know, you can delete a post. I occasionally do that specifically and only when I somehow duplicate a post. I simply enter “duplicate post” in the reason field and mark the deletion option. Happens maybe once a year. It seems a bit cleaner to me.

    "The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." ó Abraham Lincoln

    I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

    The Leif Ericson Cruiser

  13. #1693
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,792
    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    I knew about the school thing having worked at several. There is really dark time in February where you know you're going to get sick. I didn't know that masks were not proven against the flu.
    Here is a review from 2012:
    There were 17 eligible studies. Six of eight randomised controlled trials found no significant differences between control and intervention groups (masks with or without hand hygiene; N95/P2 respirators). One household trial found that mask wearing coupled with hand sanitiser use reduced secondary transmission of upper respiratory infection/influenza‐like illness/laboratory‐confirmed influenza compared with education; hand sanitiser alone resulted in no reduction. One hospital‐based trial found a lower rate of clinical respiratory illness associated with non‐fit‐tested N95 respirator use compared with medical masks. Eight of nine retrospective observational studies found that mask and/or respirator use was independently associated with a reduced risk of severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS). Findings, however, may not be applicable to influenza and many studies were suboptimal. None of the studies established a conclusive relationship between mask/respirator use and protection against influenza infection. Some evidence suggests that mask use is best undertaken as part of a package of personal protection especially hand hygiene. The effectiveness of masks and respirators is likely linked to early, consistent and correct usage.
    If you look at multiple reviews, there's also quite a degree of variability in the conclusions authors reach after reviewing the same evidence, which is another sign that there's no compelling evidence one way or another.

    That was more or less the state of play when Covid kicked off, and explains the ambivalence of epidemiologists and virologists about the whole "masks for the public" deal. We kind of got lucky that transmission from contaminated surfaces turned out not to be a major feature of Covid (remember all those "SARS-CoV-2 RNA persists on surfaces for weeks!" headlines?), because there was a real potential, going in, that amateur mask use and reuse would generate more contaminated surfaces than it prevented, and a real sense of dread that general masking would turn out to be a really, really bad idea.

    By locking down and reducing international travel during the flu seasons in the southern and northern hemispheres, we've actually done a bit of a reset on the flu virus--it will be interesting to see what happens over the next few years, in that regard.

    Grant Hutchison

  14. #1694
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Posts
    2,328
    The two of us have eaten out a few times and went on an overnight getaway since we were fully vaccinated. We will still wear masks while inside buildings until the proverbial coast is determined to be fully clear. The one place we will continue to always wear a mask from here on out is when we go to the doctor's office/waiting room. N-95s and nothing less.

  15. #1695
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Olympia, WA
    Posts
    31,902
    All of my decisions about what we're going to do are based on having two children in the house. They're talking September. I will keep wearing a mask to model the good behaviour for my kids. I will keep socially distancing in public to model good behaviour for my kids. (At home? The science seems to be that we'll be keeping the kids safe as long as we're all vaccinated.) I feel as though the CDC's problem is that the virology made one thing the right answer and the sociology made another one the right answer.
    _____________________________________________
    Gillian

    "Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

    "You can't erase icing."

    "I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

  16. #1696
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    The Great NorthWet
    Posts
    17,098
    Covid-19 has popped up in my dreams the last two nights. I don't recall that happening before. Last night I was in some sort of gathering and was horrified to realize I'd forgotten my mask. Then saw that almost nobody else had one either. The dream then segued into one of those back-in-school can't find the next class ones.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  17. #1697
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    20,792
    That's another "typical" dream I never seem to have. My wife, who greatly enjoyed her school days, now seems to have fairly frequent anxiety dreams about it. Whereas I, who had a thoroughly miserable time at school, can't remember ever dreaming about it at all.

    Grant Hutchison

  18. #1698
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Nowhere (middle)
    Posts
    39,519
    I freely admit that the frequent changes in advice and regulations from all sources have taken their toll on my decision making. I am sticking with all reasonable precautions --masks, distancing, staying home unless necessary-- until and unless the announcement is made that there's no longer a pandemic happening, or until the death rate shrinks down to something that seems reasonable. (And no, I can't put numbers to that yet. We're still in crisis mode, it's far too soon to even consider.)
    "I'm planning to live forever. So far, that's working perfectly." Steven Wright

  19. #1699
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Norfolk UK and some of me is in Northern France
    Posts
    9,919
    Quote Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
    You know, you can delete a post. I occasionally do that specifically and only when I somehow duplicate a post. I simply enter “duplicate post” in the reason field and mark the deletion option. Happens maybe once a year. It seems a bit cleaner to me.
    Thanks I will try that next time. I find sometimes the post hangs around as if I forgot to hit the button, but then it’s a duplicate. Cancel in the edit facility just cancels the edit.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  20. #1700
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Depew, NY
    Posts
    12,632
    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Here is a review from 2012:If you look at multiple reviews, there's also quite a degree of variability in the conclusions authors reach after reviewing the same evidence, which is another sign that there's no compelling evidence one way or another.

    That was more or less the state of play when Covid kicked off, and explains the ambivalence of epidemiologists and virologists about the whole "masks for the public" deal. We kind of got lucky that transmission from contaminated surfaces turned out not to be a major feature of Covid (remember all those "SARS-CoV-2 RNA persists on surfaces for weeks!" headlines?), because there was a real potential, going in, that amateur mask use and reuse would generate more contaminated surfaces than it prevented, and a real sense of dread that general masking would turn out to be a really, really bad idea.

    By locking down and reducing international travel during the flu seasons in the southern and northern hemispheres, we've actually done a bit of a reset on the flu virus--it will be interesting to see what happens over the next few years, in that regard.

    Grant Hutchison
    Thank you, again. This is why I love this place. Clear and good information.
    Solfe

  21. #1701
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    The Great NorthWet
    Posts
    17,098
    I realized this morning I'd missed a milestone a couple of days ago. US dead from Covid-19 now exceed 600,000. And we are still running more new cases daily than a year ago, while mask mandates are being removed.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  22. #1702
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    The Wild West
    Posts
    9,531
    The county I'm in up here in North Idaho has had a pandemic total of 43 deaths (county population 45,739). Mask wearing has always been rare except for places like Home Depot, which (supposedly) requires masks, but you still see people in there without a mask. (We always wore masks prior to getting vaccinated and sometimes even post-vaccination.) Folks up here (latitude 48.27) are apparently not very interested in getting vaccinated either, which turned out to be good for me since I was able to get Pfizerized with the first priority group when they had more vaccine than 1st priority people who wanted it. (I was 2nd or 3rd priority, but I just got a text to show up for a shot in January, which I did.)
    Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

  23. #1703
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Sioux Falls, SD
    Posts
    8,995
    Quote Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
    I realized this morning I'd missed a milestone a couple of days ago. US dead from Covid-19 now exceed 600,000. And we are still running more new cases daily than a year ago, while mask mandates are being removed.
    If you look at Worldometers breakdown page, they have the numbers for each individual state and then, at the bottom, have a separate section with things like "US Military" and "Veterans Affairs". I fear they're double-counting some cases in their totals, since (I'm guessing) those cases are already included in the relevant states' numbers.

    I don't think we've passed 600K deaths quite yet. Every other place I look at statistics says we're at 585-590K.
    Sometimes you win, sometimes you learn

  24. #1704
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Clear Lake City, TX
    Posts
    13,158
    I went to an auto glass shop the other day to get a small chip in the windshield fixed. When I entered the office I noticed there were two employees and three customers, all maskless. I checked in and then went outside to sit and wait. That's when I saw the sign on the door saying masks were required inside.

    (The tech who fixed my windshield was masked.)
    Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by ignorance or stupidity.
    Isaac Asimov

    You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. They donít alter their views to fit the facts. They alter the facts to fit their views.
    Doctor Who

    Moderation will be in purple.
    Rules for Posting to This Board

  25. #1705
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Nowhere (middle)
    Posts
    39,519
    I had a similar experience, went into a crowded store (with a mask sign) and I was the only one masked. Felt weird.
    "I'm planning to live forever. So far, that's working perfectly." Steven Wright

  26. #1706
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    The Great NorthWet
    Posts
    17,098
    Quote Originally Posted by SeanF View Post
    If you look at Worldometers breakdown page, they have the numbers for each individual state and then, at the bottom, have a separate section with things like "US Military" and "Veterans Affairs". I fear they're double-counting some cases in their totals, since (I'm guessing) those cases are already included in the relevant states' numbers.

    I don't think we've passed 600K deaths quite yet. Every other place I look at statistics says we're at 585-590K.
    Oh, that's SO much better!
    Sorry.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  27. #1707
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    1,699
    Just to show that many countries have a problem with getting people to be vaccinated against Covid. In our case it is not caused by the sort of factors that appear to be in play in the U.S. While we have a small complement of the usual fools who are against vaccines in general the major factor seems to be a feeling that if there is no Covid in the community why should I take any risk of even an very unlikely reaction. This is compounded by the ongoing border closures. Both my brothers have not made any plans to vaccinated. One, who is 75, says that he is simply being cautious. While the other one and his wife, in their early 70's, say that because they can't travel they don't see the need to take any risk of a reaction.

    Because 'everything' in the community is pretty much operating as normal, except for o/s travel, there are not the carrots about removing mask mandates or ending social distancing etc to dangle in front of the public. The concern is that something like the sudden outbreak that has just happened in Taiwan could occur in Australia.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-57181038

  28. #1708
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Posts
    52
    Quote Originally Posted by ozduck View Post
    While we have a small complement of the usual fools who are against vaccines in general the major factor seems to be a feeling that if there is no Covid in the community why should I take any risk of even an very unlikely reaction.
    Today there is no COVID, tomorrow someone brought in and the infection went like a plague in the Middle Ages. And they will sharply startle me that the state didn't provide vaccines, but in fact, they didn't go.

  29. #1709
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    14,908
    Quote Originally Posted by ozduck View Post
    Just to show that many countries have a problem with getting people to be vaccinated against Covid. In our case it is not caused by the sort of factors that appear to be in play in the U.S. While we have a small complement of the usual fools who are against vaccines in general the major factor seems to be a feeling that if there is no Covid in the community why should I take any risk of even an very unlikely reaction.
    I'm sure that plays in to it in other places too. I know that many people in Japan are hesitant to get vaccinated, because we hear a lot about the side effects and in fact most people don't know anyone around them who has been seriously ill with the disease, so it doesn't seem that close to home. And it seems to be true in other Northeast Asian countries as well.
    As above, so below

  30. #1710
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    14,908
    And one difficulty about that is that a lot of immunologists fear that COVID may become endemic, so that it will always be circulating. And that makes it difficult for places with little exposure, because if they donít get vaccinated it will make it hard to venture outside of their countries. In fact, Iíd like to get vaccinated because part of my job is attending international conferences, and I want to be able to do it again.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    As above, so below

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •