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Thread: The COVID-19 Discussion Thread (OTB)

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozduck View Post
    Our plan seems to be to slowly wind back a few restrictions at a time, not including the National border closures, and then sit back for a few weeks to ensure there is no sudden jump in infections.
    That’s similar to what California is planning. (In the US most of this level of response is done at the state level.) California is now building up a tracer army, mostly from people that aren’t in medical professions, working with a core group that is, to keep infections down when we open up. There are to be three levels to opening up the economy, the first to probably start late May, with a lot of low contact access beyond “essential” business and government opening up, then in some months, more open access still with some significant restrictions, then finally basically back to normal much later than that.

    Of course, the state can’t control the borders, and one question will be how other states will be doing and how that will affect us.

    California had similar numbers of infections to New York in early March and has about double the population but has had far fewer cases, though by no means a small number. Part of it seems to be due to implementing social distancing earlier, but also probably because our population tends to be spread out more even in the big cities. This seems to be a case where less use of public transportation has been an advantage.

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  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jens View Post
    Yes, that seems to be about what's going on here in Japan as well. Apparently Abe is going to extend the emergency declaration (if he hasn't already), and although there is no legal lock-down a lot of restaurants and coffee shops have shut down, and events are cancelled, so it's likely that will continue (a sort of low-intensity shut-down). I think it makes sense because the disruptions are not terrible and the number of new infections is going down.
    I forgot that you were in Japan. Obviously you have a far better idea what is happening than me.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strange View Post
    I went out to the shops in our little town this morning and mask wearing has got to about 100%.
    And now, with the weather improving, a lot of people are wearing sunglasses as well. It's like everyone is on their way to rob a bank or something.
    Last edited by Strange; 2020-Apr-30 at 11:07 AM.

  4. #94
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    I suspect I am going to need a mask just to avoid having issues if I decide to go somewhere (like Costco, as mentioned above). I may have some dust masks in the garage. Failing that, I will likely see about making or buying one. Not that I would do it if it was just up to me.

    Currently though, in about five weeks I have driven once, and didn’t get out of the car. I went to a drive through pharmacy, where there is a metal drawer thing to transfer the medicine - better than a mask to stop transfer of a virus. Also picked up some food in a drive through fast food place for a change. Not quite as good distancing there, but not bad, Of course I washed my hands and was careful with packages when I got home.

    "The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." — Abraham Lincoln

    I say there is an invisible elf in my backyard. How do you prove that I am wrong?

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  5. #95
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    Not so sure about that metal drawer. Who knows how many other customers have touched it.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Rijn View Post
    That’s similar to what California is planning. (In the US most of this level of response is done at the state level.) California is now building up a tracer army, mostly from people that aren’t in medical professions, working with a core group that is, to keep infections down when we open up. There are to be three levels to opening up the economy, the first to probably start late May, with a lot of low contact access beyond “essential” business and government opening up, then in some months, more open access still with some significant restrictions, then finally basically back to normal much later than that.

    Of course, the state can’t control the borders, and one question will be how other states will be doing and how that will affect us.

    California had similar numbers of infections to New York in early March and has about double the population but has had far fewer cases, though by no means a small number. Part of it seems to be due to implementing social distancing earlier, but also probably because our population tends to be spread out more even in the big cities. This seems to be a case where less use of public transportation has been an advantage.
    In Australia a "National Cabinet" has been set up to combat the spread of infection. It consists of the Prime Minister and the Premiers or Chief Officers of the States and Territories. They come from both sides of the political spectrum and so far it has worked very well in ensuring an effective minimum national approach has been adopted. Some states rules have been more stringent than this. We have had 6,753 confirmed cases nationwide. Of these 994 cases are still active. And of those active cases 89 are in hospital with 34 of those in ICU. The rest are in isolation with usually only relatively mild symptoms. There have been 92 deaths so far in a country of 26 Million. But every death is a loss.

    We have certainly not claimed victory which is why the restrictions will only be removed in stages. There have been a couple of outbreaks in small hospitals and also nursing homes for the elderly which have caused and will, unfortunately, probably still cause a disproportionate number of deaths. We have suffered huge financial losses but, so far at least, relatively small humanitarian losses.

    The only major tension has been about when the schools will restart. The Federal point of view is that it should be happening now. However the each state has been going its own way on this question. In my state, W.A ,schools went back yesterday. Attendance is not compulsory and Catholic and some Private Schools have not restarted.

    As with the U.S, the National Border is the responsibility of the central government. Sea and air freight is still flowing but only Australian Citizens or Permanent Residents are allowed to enter. When they arrive they are escorted straight from the airport to a hotel and kept in strict isolation for 14 days. In W.A we have also closed a holiday island, Rottnest Island known for its Quokkas, and placed several hundred arrivals at a time in the empty holiday chalets. Evacuation flights are still arriving.

    Also, most of the states have put restrictions on people crossing their borders. This is allowable under the Public Health powers in the Constitution. My state has the most restrictive rules with only "Authorised Persons", who must obtain a permit, allowed to cross the border. This is fairly easy to police as while we have a state land border of just under 1,900 Km there are only 2 sealed roads and 1 railway line crossing it. And there is plenty of desert etc between us and the other states. Further the state itself has also had internal 'borders' introduced to stop people travelling between 9 separate regions without permission. This has been done partly to stop the country regions being flooded with people from the city. However, a major concern has been a so far successful attempt to stop this disease from infecting isolated and very vulnerable Aboriginal communities.

    This has been accepted relatively well as little local transmission has occurred with around 85% of all cases in W.A being directly related to overseas travel. In this case Australian's love of overseas travel has come back to bite us. Currently there 13 people in hospital with 3 in ICU here. W.A has a population of around 2.6 Million and we have suffered 8 deaths to date.

    Of course our actions have been easier to take than for many countries as we solely occupy a large 'island continent' and can easily close our borders. Also Australians have had the necessity for strong quarantine measures drummed into us from our earliest years. We are well aware that these measures have kept Rabies, Foot and Mouth Disease, Malaria etc from gaining a foothold here. The results of introducing rabbits and cane toads and so forth much earlier has made us learn our lessons well and accept that quarantine and isolation measures can be very effective.
    Last edited by ozduck; 2020-Apr-30 at 03:27 PM.

  7. #97
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    I'm going to urgent care today for unrelated reasons (piece of glass in my foot), and they have set up an appointment system and I'm to check in from the car when I get there. I also made myself a mask this morning, since I'm not sure where my other two that I made earlier are.
    _____________________________________________
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  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gillianren View Post
    I'm going to urgent care today for unrelated reasons (piece of glass in my foot), and they have set up an appointment system and I'm to check in from the car when I get there. I also made myself a mask this morning, since I'm not sure where my other two that I made earlier are.
    Ow. Hope your foot gets better soon.
    At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

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  9. #99
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    As mask wearing increases, I think that this will soon be considered the proper attire for shopping (photos are of a friend of a friend).

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    Conserve energy. Commute with the Hamiltonian.

  10. #100
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    Ooooh. I like it, but I'm not sure about how well the Black Death reference will play, generally. Maybe the people most likely to be upset are least likely to get the allusion.

    Grant Hutchison

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Ooooh. I like it, but I'm not sure about how well the Black Death reference will play, generally. Maybe the people most likely to be upset are least likely to get the allusion. Grant Hutchison
    Maybe the people who get the allusion will be the ones who laugh hardest, as I just about did.
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  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    Ooooh. I like it, but I'm not sure about how well the Black Death reference will play, generally. Maybe the people most likely to be upset are least likely to get the allusion.

    Grant Hutchison
    I am part of a group on Facebook that likes corvids (ravens, crows, jays, etc.). There have been more than a few references to such masks since the whole virus thing started. And more than a few jokes and comments about Covid versus corvid.
    At night the stars put on a show for free (Carole King)

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  13. #103
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    Coronavirus sounds too festive. COVID-19 sounds like we survived 18 of something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift View Post
    I am part of a group on Facebook that likes corvids (ravens, crows, jays, etc.). There have been more than a few references to such masks since the whole virus thing started. And more than a few jokes and comments about Covid versus corvid.
    Corvid19 wears a beakmask, wise bird.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck View Post
    Coronavirus sounds too festive. COVID-19 sounds like we survived 18 of something.
    I scored par on 18 rounds in the Gilead Stay-At-Home Open so now it's off to the COVID19th hole for my liquid inoculations.

  16. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift View Post
    I am part of a group on Facebook that likes corvids (ravens, crows, jays, etc.). There have been more than a few references to such masks since the whole virus thing started. And more than a few jokes and comments about Covid versus corvid.
    The plague doctor masks always make me think of an ibis.
    But the look is not going down so well in the UK.

    Grant Hutchison

  17. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift View Post
    I am part of a group on Facebook that likes corvids (ravens, crows, jays, etc.). There have been more than a few references to such masks since the whole virus thing started. And more than a few jokes and comments about Covid versus corvid.
    The opening scenes of the 1980s TV miniseries of Stephen King's The Stand showed a crow acting in a highly intelligent manner during the disease outbreak (it was a monster), and a recent SF/fantasy book on a bird-flu pandemic made considerable use of crows as observers to events, as if they had something to do with it.
    Do good work. —Virgil Ivan "Gus" Grissom

  18. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger E. Moore View Post
    The opening scenes of the 1980s TV miniseries of Stephen King's The Stand showed a crow acting in a highly intelligent manner during the disease outbreak (it was a monster), and a recent SF/fantasy book on a bird-flu pandemic made considerable use of crows as observers to events, as if they had something to do with it.
    Stone the crows, mate!
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  19. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    As mask wearing increases, I think that this will soon be considered the proper attire for shopping (photos are of a friend of a friend).

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    And the "skirt" enforces distancing!

    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    The plague doctor masks always make me think of an ibis.
    But the look is not going down so well in the UK.

    Grant Hutchison
    Some people need to develop a sense of humor, I think. Or in this case, humour.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  20. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
    Some people need to develop a sense of humor, I think. Or in this case, humour.
    Well, some people find it frightening or depressing--it's difficult to see the humour under those circumstances, and in my view reason enough not to do it.
    But I'd guess the general reaction is one of exasperated irritation, because that's how Brits generally react to people wandering around in costume. (Greg Proops used to do a very funny routine comparing the reactions of Americans and Brits on encountering a man dressed as Mickey Mouse.)

    Grant Hutchison

  21. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift View Post
    Ow. Hope your foot gets better soon.
    Oh, yeah. It took maybe five minutes. I saw a couple of other patients in the parking lot, but there was no one in the waiting room. Though as is tradition, I did have to wait in the treatment room--and as I was sitting there reading a book, like you do, I'd been alone and still in there so long that the motion-sensitive light went off!
    _____________________________________________
    Gillian

    "Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

    "You can't erase icing."

    "I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

  22. #112
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    The governor just announced that all NY schools are closed for the rest of the school year. I totally agree with it as a parent and an educator. However, it doesn't make me happy.

    Edit - Maybe it's because I hang out on science websites, but I am slight exasperated that it took 6-8 weeks for people to figure out there wasn't going to be a fix in 3-4 months, 6 to 8 weeks ago.
    Solfe

  23. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    The governor just announced that all NY schools are closed for the rest of the school year. I totally agree with it as a parent and an educator. However, it doesn't make me happy.

    Edit - Maybe it's because I hang out on science websites, but I am slight exasperated that it took 6-8 weeks for people to figure out there wasn't going to be a fix in 3-4 months, 6 to 8 weeks ago.
    We are still waiting for any evidence of child to adult transmission, so far none.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  24. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
    And the "skirt" enforces distancing!
    Yes, I thought the skirt was a nice touch.
    Conserve energy. Commute with the Hamiltonian.

  25. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    We are still waiting for any evidence of child to adult transmission, so far none.
    That's not my concern as a parent or educator. As an educator, I have students with autism that can't social distance and have negative (violent) reactions to people in gloves and masks. Asking them to wear them is out of the question. Most of my students are so "deep" on the autism spectrum that they are wildly outside the typical person's understanding of autism.
    Solfe

  26. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    We are still waiting for any evidence of child to adult transmission, so far none.
    So the Daily Mail claims. The rather informal review that led to those headlines is much more nuanced, and one of its authors has already said that children almost certainly do transmit Covid-19--they're just not big contributors to community transmission, despite being promiscuous little secretion-sharers.

    Grant Hutchison

  27. #117
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    I'm ordering a couple of t-shirts with the words: "Promiscuous little secretion-sharers".
    Solfe

  28. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    So the Daily Mail claims. The rather informal review that led to those headlines is much more nuanced, and one of its authors has already said that children almost certainly do transmit Covid-19--they're just not big contributors to community transmission, despite being promiscuous little secretion-sharers.

    Grant Hutchison
    It was the Telegraph, we bought it to light fires. But not figuratively, so good to be corrected.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  29. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    The plague doctor masks always make me think of an ibis.
    But the look is not going down so well in the UK.

    Grant Hutchison
    Maybe hoop skirts will make a comeback. Here, nicely combined with a stylish plague-doctor mask: https://brucesterling.tumblr.com/pos...nce-hoop-skirt

    ETA: just catching up - I see someone beat me to it.

  30. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by grant hutchison View Post
    So the Daily Mail claims. The rather informal review that led to those headlines is much more nuanced, and one of its authors has already said that children almost certainly do transmit Covid-19--they're just not big contributors to community transmission, despite being promiscuous little secretion-sharers.
    Besides, is there evidence of child-to-child transmission? And what are the odds that those several dozen adults in a school will pass them to one another, and to any parents who drop off and pick up their children at school? Even leaving the children aside, there are plenty of ways for schools to transmit diseases.
    _____________________________________________
    Gillian

    "Now everyone was giving her that kind of look UFOlogists get when they suddenly say, 'Hey, if you shade your eyes you can see it is just a flock of geese after all.'"

    "You can't erase icing."

    "I can't believe it doesn't work! I found it on the internet, man!"

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