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Thread: Adventures in DIY

  1. #931
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    Quote Originally Posted by PetersCreek View Post
    Finally done:
    Very nice. So they're ready to go right after coming out of the fuming tubs?

  2. #932
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    Quote Originally Posted by geonuc View Post
    Very nice. So they're ready to go right after coming out of the fuming tubs?
    Thanks. I installed the hinges and gave them another buffing but they were pretty much ready out of the tub.
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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

  3. #933
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    Feast your eyes of this telescope treatment:
    https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/the-...#post-13050818

    I wish I were that talented.

  4. #934
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    I went ahead and bought a 3/4" Laguna Resaw King blade for the bandsaw. Works pretty well.

    It would have been good if I actually turned on my dust collector, though. I tend not to do that for bandsaw cuts because it doesn't throw so much fine dust in the air. But for cutting through 4 inches along a three foot mahogany board, I went ahead and ran the collector hose to the saw. Just forgot to turn it on.

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  5. #935
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    Nice. I like to run the DC for any bandsaw operation because my minds eye pictures dust packing into every nook and cranny around the lower tire.

    I spent the day in Anchorage shopping with The Wife and had some DIY waiting for me. High winds knocked a tree onto our deck.



    Only minor damage to section of railing. Unfortunately, Id been putting off replacing the bar and chain on my chainsaw but I was able to knock off the majority of it with a pull saw.

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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

  6. #936
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    Can't wait to see what you make out of the tree pieces!
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  7. #937
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    I have this electrical problem. There seems to be too many things on a 15 amp breaker. So I bought a new 15 amp breaker, because the old one seems bad. The real solution is to find out what is on this line and move something off of this line. Then I will replace the breaker. It works but feels "loose", better safe than sorry.

    This is all in my basement and I can follow the wires easily because there are no walls and nothing is finished. I walked to the left, because that is where I believed there to be the problem: a computer, a printer and a light all on one plug. Sound like a problem. As I paced off to the left, I counted 3 plugs. Two are for the washer and dryer (120 lines, but one each for some reason). A third is unused. As I continued to the left, I find the plug which I think is the problem is on an entirely different circuit.

    (To be honest, I didn't look at the breaker box to trace the wires at first, because I assumed...)

    Back to the breaker box. I walked down a circuit to the right. It does end at the problematical plug and that plug is the last item on the circuit.

    Ok. Now the headache. As I trace the wire from the breaker box to the problem plug, I notice a couple of things. First, this line goes into a junction box. One line in, two lines out. One of the two lines out continues to the right and ends at the problem plug (there is a lot of stuff between here and there, a bar, Cd player, radio, amp, a pair of computer stations, an electronic dart board, etc.). The other doubles back to the left, goes past the circuit box and to the empty plug I found on the left.

    What?

    If you were going to use a junction box, wouldn't it have made sense to put it right in front of the circuit box where it would have been most efficient? Maybe you aren't supposed to do that? It seems like a bad plan to me, because it is more junk in around something important.

    I have empty breaker slots in the box. A lot of them. I'm going to buy more wire and 15 amp breakers and have four plugs on three different breakers. I can't see messing with the washer and drier lines. It works and while redundant, it's also wonderfully straight forward. The plug that is currently empty and the plug that seems to be the problem can go on the third breaker. Simple, right?

    Does that look like a bad solution?
    Solfe

  8. #938
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    I have this electrical problem. ...

    Does that look like a bad solution?
    I'm sorry but your narrative does not paint a clear picture. Are you familiar with the electrical code?

  9. #939
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    120V dryer? They are always 240 as far as I know.

    Do NOT mess with the washer and dryer, regardless.

    Oh, and what's the total capacity of the box?

    ETA: My rule of home plumbing is never do anything myself that requires shutting off the whole house, in case I can't get it back together. I think that applies to electrical as well.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  10. #940
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    Your box will have an overall fuse or breaker and should have a GFCI (ground fault protection) although some USA situations use GFCI only on specific loads. The main point to emphasise is that the prime reason for breakers is to protect the cables from too much current which causes heating and potentially fires. The cable must be correct for the breaker limit. The loads on any breaker should never exceed 80% of the breaker value (you can check if local rules change this). That load is assuming all the loads are switched on, even if you think in practice they are not. So you can have many sockets but not too many loads and if the breaker trips it may be doing its job correctly. Breakers derate with temperature including from self heating at high load, meaning a 15 amp breaker may trip at 10 or 12 amps if it is hot.

    If this is gobbledygook to you, maybe you should get an electrician in?
    Last edited by profloater; 2019-Aug-21 at 11:48 AM. Reason: typo
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  11. #941
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    Quote Originally Posted by geonuc View Post
    I'm sorry but your narrative does not paint a clear picture. Are you familiar with the electrical code?
    Yeah, I used to work for the electrical company.

    Edit - This is a pre-coffee post. "Worked for the electrical company" really doesn't cover your concern. I know that. I am familiar with code, but what I am looking at is completely unreasonable. See next post.
    Last edited by Solfe; 2019-Aug-21 at 01:31 PM.
    Solfe

  12. #942
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    Quote Originally Posted by profloater View Post
    Your box will have an overall fuse or breaker and should have a GFCI (ground fault protection) although some USA situations use GFCI only on specific loads. The main point to emphasise is that the prime reason for breakers is to protect the cables from too much current which causes heating and potentially fires. The cable must be correct for the breaker limit. The loads on any breaker should never exceed 80% of the breaker value (you can check if local rules change this). That load is assuming all the loads are switched on, even if you think in practice they are not. So you can have many sockets but not too many loads and if the breaker trips it may be doing its job correctly. Breakers derate with temperature including from self heating at high load, meaning a 15 amp breaker may trip at 10 or 12 amps if it is hot.

    If this is gobbledygook to you, maybe you should get an electrician in?
    Yes, that makes sense. The box is rated high enough, but one circuit is way overload, while multiple other circuits have only one or very few items on it.

    This is a case of me believing that I had a sense-able circuit when I did not. I had thought our basement was being provided power by 5 breakers with a proper load. (I didn't mention the breaker for the furnace, because I'm not messing with that item.) In reality it has two circuits that are fine for the washer and drier, but then two circuits that are a mess where one is very conservatively wired and the other was expanded and expanded to beyond reason-ability.

    The two circuits that are a mess have 15 amp breakers and wiring to support that load. One circuit only has 4.5 amps of capacity - 3 plugs. That's fine. Some of those aren't in use at all for practical consideration. The other line is so overloaded, 9 plugs or lights on it. No one has accounted for whatever might be plugged into this circuit. In my opinion, it could easily be carrying twice the load it is rated for. The bar has a blender, which makes me cringe. The bar should have ground fault protectors, but doesn't. (Which circles back to what about the circuit box, do I have the capacity to match what I have?)

    Last night, I unplugged nearly everything on that line. Then I walked the line again marking it with a paint pen. Since nothing is really necessary on that line (except one light), the breaker is off for further review. I did replace that breaker, because I didn't trust it but what it is connected to isn't safe. So it stays off until I can figure out what to do.

    As I am looking around this morning, I can see that this is a case for "new everything". Which brings me back to the point of the advice given, hire someone. This has become a very large headache. While I want to reduce the capacity on the line, which is totally safe to do, but I see no good path forward. The two computers on that line are an easy choice, remove them, box them up and store them. Every permeation ends with a bar that isn't powered. That bar is such a mess, I am considering removing the bar, which is a lot more that what I considered when I started.

    This mess has gone from fix a light, to remodel the house.
    Last edited by Solfe; 2019-Aug-21 at 01:38 PM. Reason: ground fault vs ground fault protectors
    Solfe

  13. #943
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    Yeah, I used to work for the electrical company.

    Edit - This is a pre-coffee post. "Worked for the electrical company" really doesn't cover your concern. I know that. I am familiar with code, but what I am looking at is completely unreasonable. See next post.
    You're right, it didn't. Thanks for the edit.

    Hiring an electrician will always be the best choice in terms of meeting code but you may find he or she will want to do things that you hadn't considered to bring the house to code.

    For myself, in my last house which had mostly exposed wiring, I just about rewired the whole place, following the code mostly but where not, I upgraded. I used a lot of 12 AWG on 15 amp circuits. I installed a 30 amp circuit (10 AWG) to run my table saw and dust collector. I also kept a log book of all the house's circuits and the loads on each, both hard-wired and plugged in. Each outlet and load was numbered with a permanent marker. That logbook was a great help as I continued to upgrade.

    One suggestion: if your problem circuit's wiring path is accessible, have you considered upgrading to a 20 amp circuit?

  14. #944
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    Reinforcements are here! My neighbor who's husband work in construction just told me: "You can't have a bar in your basement. My husband has removed three on this street, not including ours."

    Later, I am going to get a tour of his house and ask him over for advice.
    Solfe

  15. #945
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    Ya
    Quote Originally Posted by Solfe View Post
    Yes, that makes sense. The box is rated high enough, but one circuit is way overload, while multiple other circuits have only one or very few items on it.

    This is a case of me believing that I had a sense-able circuit when I did not. I had thought our basement was being provided power by 5 breakers with a proper load. (I didn't mention the breaker for the furnace, because I'm not messing with that item.) In reality it has two circuits that are fine for the washer and drier, but then two circuits that are a mess where one is very conservatively wired and the other was expanded and expanded to beyond reason-ability.

    The two circuits that are a mess have 15 amp breakers and wiring to support that load. One circuit only has 4.5 amps of capacity - 3 plugs. That's fine. Some of those aren't in use at all for practical consideration. The other line is so overloaded, 9 plugs or lights on it. No one has accounted for whatever might be plugged into this circuit. In my opinion, it could easily be carrying twice the load it is rated for. The bar has a blender, which makes me cringe. The bar should have ground fault protectors, but doesn't. (Which circles back to what about the circuit box, do I have the capacity to match what I have?)

    Last night, I unplugged nearly everything on that line. Then I walked the line again marking it with a paint pen. Since nothing is really necessary on that line (except one light), the breaker is off for further review. I did replace that breaker, because I didn't trust it but what it is connected to isn't safe. So it stays off until I can figure out what to do.

    As I am looking around this morning, I can see that this is a case for "new everything". Which brings me back to the point of the advice given, hire someone. This has become a very large headache. While I want to reduce the capacity on the line, which is totally safe to do, but I see no good path forward. The two computers on that line are an easy choice, remove them, box them up and store them. Every permeation ends with a bar that isn't powered. That bar is such a mess, I am considering removing the bar, which is a lot more that what I considered when I started.

    This mess has gone from fix a light, to remodel the house.
    It may not be so bad, computers do not take much load although they can trip GFCI, you are right to allocate breakers to loads, the sum of all breakers can exceed the value of the upstream breaker although obviously the total load must be within 80% of that upper limit. All of the cables supplied by a breaker must be rated for that 15 amps, including all the appliance cords. If an appliance states say 10 amps then you need 10 amp breaker for that appliance. Comp uters and things with transformers or large motors can trip GFCI especially on starting, and can have inrush currents that can trip breakers too. It can be a drag. Important things like computers should therefore have their own breaker if possible.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  16. #946
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    How do computers trip the GFCI? Because our new washing machine, with computerized controls, does that.
    Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt.

  17. #947
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
    How do computers trip the GFCI? Because our new washing machine, with computerized controls, does that.
    It depends on the power supply and size of-the transformer, older types use 60hz but newer use switched mode high frequency switching. The older type have higher inrush current when switched on. Modern GFCI in USA trip at 5 mA although you will find many at 30 mA. For reference 30mA is regarded as rarely fatal and is used EU RCDs. Modern GFCI are not ground current detectors, but use differential current in the two live lines.
    Any inductance has a virtual current 90 degrees out of phase with the main current, but this can still be detected by the differential circuit within the GFCI. If there are several devices on the same GFCI the out of phase current can trip the sensitive device. There are in fact different grades of GFCI to allow high inductance devices to be protected although I have encountered electricians who do not know this!. In USA 240 v GFCI are significantly more expensive but they do exist as do three phase types. In my experience the modern electronic types of GFCI including combination GFCI/breaker types are very sensitive and-can be a pain for inductive loads.

    We have flat panel heaters in our equipment which have a small capacitance and these can also trip 5mA breakers if there are other loads on the same circuit.
    As a final nerd note, badly wired neutrals or return circuits can also cause tripping of GFCI because small voltage differences can arise, these cause unequal currents whichthe GFCI detects.
    sicut vis videre esto
    When we realize that patterns don't exist in the universe, they are a template that we hold to the universe to make sense of it, it all makes a lot more sense.
    Originally Posted by Ken G

  18. #948
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    I need some advice from our resident woodworking master (or anyone else that wants to chime in).

    I need to attach moulding pieces to drawer fronts. Everything is solid mahogany - no plywood. The drawer fronts are frame & panel with the panel set in 1/4" slots routed in the frame pieces. The panel is free floating to a small degree (no glue) - the frame captures the panel. The moulding pieces are designed to sit inside the frame on the panel and sit proud of the frame (i.e. they stick up above the frame). Hopefully the photos show the design adequately. The moulding is just pressed into place at the moment while I figure out what to do.

    My question is how to secure the moulding and whether to do it to the frame or the panel. My thought was to drill small holes into the top of the crown of the moulding for small nails (brads) to make sure it stays snug against the frame and also apply glue as necessary. I also can drill from the backside through the panel into the moulding so as to not have the brads show. I'm not too worried about that as the original piece has visible brads in places (I'm duplicating an old Pakistani chest of drawers). I can also drill at a 45 degree angle through the moulding into the frame, avoiding the panel.

    My concern is expansion of the wood over time and seasons. If I attach the moulding solidly to the panel with brads and glue, I may have future issue with differential expansion between the panel and frame. Or should I not be worried and just use glue?

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  19. #949
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    I have an approach in mind but first, are you going to pre-finish the panels and if so, with what?
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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

  20. #950
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    I hadn't decided on finish yet but my plan was to attach the moulding prior to finish.

  21. #951
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    I asked because pre-finishing could make gluing the molding to the rails and stiles simpler. Besides preventing the exposure of unfinished wood should the panel have some seasonal shrinkage, pre-finishing would make squeeze out at the back-bottom edge of the molding less likely to stick to the panel.

    A trick I would consider using is to leave small spots free of PVA glue...one at each end of the and one or more in between...then put a small drop of CA adhesive in those spots to act as liquid brads while the PVA cures. Ive only tried this a coupe of times myself, so Id practice on scrap first. Otherwise, Id probably use the 23-ga pin nailer.
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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

  22. #952
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    I don't have a pin nailer, nor an air compressor to operate one. Maybe this is the time to get those tools. I have a lot of these panels to do and drilling and driving 19-ga brads seems tedious. And yes, I was thinking of gluing in the middle of the top and bottom pieces leaving most of the ends glue-free. The end pieces can be glued along the whole length.

    Thanks for the advice. I'll consider finishing the panels first.

  23. #953
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    My current project isn't exactly fine woodworking. Our summer heat wave convinced us to put a ceiling fan in the master bedroom but the wrinkle is, our ceiling is pitched. The fan can be mounted on an angled ceiling but we'd rather keep it centered on the room. This calls from some kind of adapter. I don't want to get into the drywall...because, blown-in insulation...so I intend to scab a box onto the finished ceiling. Construction is a combination of poplar and Baltic birch plywood, intentionally over-over-engineered to be bomb proof. Here's a test fit of the panel inset and junction box, with some flushing up of corners and edges, yet to do:

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    Next comes a touch more sanding, a hole for wiring access, and some primer and paint. Then it gets lagged to a rafter. Wiring will go through surface mounted raceway from an old lighting junction a few feet away...again, to stay out of the drywall.
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  24. #954
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    Saturday, I finished sanding the box, then I brushed a few coats of B-I-N primer on the box and laid on a coat of latex paint. The first can of paint I put my hands on was a light cream we used on the trim, so I used that.

    Today, I drilled and counterbored holes for the lag screws and put the box in its in place. Two 6 and two 4 lags. I could hang a tire swing from it, I think. Then I installed the raceway and ran the wiring.



    Before I install the fan, Im going to repaint the box in white. Instead of tying in with the rest of the trim, that cream color just looks dingy up there.
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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

  25. #955
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    I see a cream box and I want it painted white. It looks old and discolored in cream, so I too think it would look far neater in white.
    With sufficient thrust, water towers fly just fine.

  26. #956
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    Quote Originally Posted by geonuc View Post
    I need some advice from our resident woodworking master (or anyone else that wants to chime in).
    No advice from me, but boy is that beautiful.
    Solfe

  27. #957
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    And we have an operational ceiling fan...



    ...just in time for next summer.
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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

  28. #958
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    That's a nice installation. And a big fan.

  29. #959
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    Moving on with my Pakistani chest of drawers project while I await delivery of brass screws: making the legs. This required building a custom jig - cutting tapers on the table saw is not straight forward. It's easier on the bandsaw but not as clean. I first had to glue two pieces of mahogany together to obtain the proper thickness for the legs.

    The taper jig is constructed to make the first cut, then adjusted to make the other three. I suppose I could have built a jig that had an adjustable side stop but I don't anticipate doing a whole lot of cabinet leg-making, so I just unscrewed the side stop and re-screwed it accordingly. Worked fine. The hold-down clamp probably was sufficient to keep the pieces in place but because of the short length of wood and the ability of the table saw to fling things across the room that aren't secured well enough, I added another clamp.

    After making the four cuts, I realized I should have trimmed the top and bottom ends of the legs while everything was still square but it shouldn't be difficult to do on the table saw sled using the pieces that were cut off to make the tapers. Looks like that blade needs to be sharpened too.

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  30. #960
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    Quote Originally Posted by geonuc View Post
    That's a nice installation. And a big fan.
    Thanks. The room's major dimensions are 15' x 20' so some size was called for. At 68 inches, it is fairly large but not huge. I do think I'm going to replace the 18" down rod with a 12-incher.
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    Man is a tool-using animal. Nowhere do you find him without tools; without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all. Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)

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